WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.100 --> 00:00:17.920 Welcome back, listeners. I'm Troy Monson. And I'm Daniel Burke. And together- Oh, am I saying it? [laughs] Welcome back, listeners. I'm Troy Monson. [laughs] Welcome back, listeners. I'm Troy Monson. 2 00:00:17.940 --> 00:00:28.680 And I'm Daniel Burke. And together we're Two Dads and Tech. Every episode we talk about things people think about, but don't talk about. I think that's good. I feel like it needs a sign-off. 3 00:00:29.060 --> 00:00:41.360 But why don't we just get into the episode? Yeah, let's get started. Hey, Daniel. How are you? I'm doing well, man. How are you doing? I'm doing good. I wanted to start this episode off hot. 4 00:00:41.420 --> 00:00:55.500 It's episode 11, so it only makes sense to start off the right way. That's right. Give me your top three biggest fraud sales influencers on LinkedIn. Oh, man. Fraud? Oh. Yeah. 5 00:00:55.530 --> 00:01:03.500 People- [laughs] We're not throwing people under the bus today, are we? I'm just- Okay... kidding. I'm just kidding. There's none. Everyone's real. There's none. Okay, okay. Am I supposed to answer that? 6 00:01:03.560 --> 00:01:09.240 Because I can think of a couple. [laughs] No, don't answer it. Okay. Don't answer it at all. I was gonna- Don't answer it... 7 00:01:09.260 --> 00:01:19.520 my, my cop-out answer was gonna be that one guy that, I can't even remember what he founded, but... No, no, no, I'm not... It's, that's not, that's not PG. [laughs] I'm not even gonna go there. For- forget it. 8 00:01:19.590 --> 00:01:28.220 [laughs] I just remembered why he was a fraud and it's, we don't wanna talk about that. [laughs] Hold up. I'm trying to think of who it is. If it's not PG, uh- Oh, man. It's, it's-... I don't know. Yeah. 9 00:01:28.260 --> 00:01:38.800 Let's just, let's just sweep that one under the rug. Listen, happy birthday. Happy birthday. Hey. Happy birthday. How you feeling this morning? You know, I'm good. I'm good. How are you feeling? 10 00:01:38.840 --> 00:01:49.060 You were sick yesterday, or a little sick. Yeah, yeah. I was sick earlier this week. Uh, woke up with a sore throat on Tuesday. I set my alarm to go to the gym. I woke up and i- it was just immediate no. 11 00:01:49.160 --> 00:01:58.060 It was that sore throat where you're like, "No, this isn't just, like, dry, you know, throat. This is, this is something." So that lasted- Yeah... a couple days. Uh, my voice... 12 00:01:58.480 --> 00:02:07.440 W- we, you and I were gonna record this yesterday and I was like, "No, not gonna- Yeah... not gonna work. I'm gonna have to push this a day." So, but no, feeling great, feeling great. Look, I do have a question for you. 13 00:02:07.450 --> 00:02:11.340 I'm gonna start it off right off the bat- Ooh... if that's okay. Okay, let's go. Yeah, yeah. 14 00:02:11.360 --> 00:02:21.660 So I was doing some digging, looking at startup culture, people who talk about families with startups, and I actually came across something Paul Graham wrote. This is, like, 15, 20 years ago. 15 00:02:21.760 --> 00:02:33.160 Paul Graham's the co-founder of Y Combinator, you know, very successful, well-known. And he said in this blog, the title was Why Not to Start a Startup. 16 00:02:34.160 --> 00:02:50.740 And in this blog, Paul Graham advises against starting a startup if you have a family to support due to just inherent risks that are involved with competing responsibilities, maybe a spouse, kids in the home, all of the different competing priorities that come with having a family. 17 00:02:51.400 --> 00:03:05.100 You have a startup, you have a family. So I, I, I thought why not ask Troy, who's in the thick of it right now, how can you balance the demands of a startup with all of the competing family responsibilities? 18 00:03:06.860 --> 00:03:19.640 First and foremost, Paul Graham, he is the GOAT. Um, this question, I, I'm gonna answer this in a way that's probably not expected. I don't think you can balance it, um, for the most part. 19 00:03:19.700 --> 00:03:30.020 And ask any, any founder that's founded a company that's more than just, like, a lifestyle business. So I don't know, does Tyler Dink, does he have any kids, family, anything like that? He's got... 20 00:03:30.360 --> 00:03:36.740 Currently, currently, I think he has a girlfriend but none of them yet. Yeah. That's, that's, that's kind of what I, what I get from him. 21 00:03:36.940 --> 00:03:49.790 Um, and I say this because I feel like when you're running a high growth or attempting to run a high growth startup, I really don't think that you can balance many other things, and so it comes- Mm... 22 00:03:49.790 --> 00:03:58.200 with, it comes with challenges in the family, for sure. That's one thing. Like, there are definitely conversations that we've had, I'd probably say a dozen times. 23 00:03:58.240 --> 00:04:08.640 I've only gone full time since September, and so there's probably a dozen conversations in the last five months that we've had about, you know, family has to come first and all that stuff. 24 00:04:08.680 --> 00:04:23.200 And realistically, I think that if the expectations aren't set and if you're not being real with your significant other, with your family, whatever it might be, I think that it would... it could definitely ruin 25 00:04:24.240 --> 00:04:37.140 couples, it can ruin marriages- Mm... it can ruin how you are. Like, I, um, this is kind of going off on a tangent here, but one of my favorite CROs ever, he traveled for 350 days out of 365 days. 26 00:04:37.260 --> 00:04:46.520 He wasn't- Oh my gosh... a founder, but he was the CRO of a company that ended up IPO-ing, so he of course ended up doing really, really well. Yeah. But I was like, "Dude, I would never be able to live like that." 27 00:04:46.600 --> 00:04:54.500 And that's kind of like how it is as a founder minus all that travel. Yeah. It's like you're still spending all that time away, but you're probably locked up or in an office, you know, in your own city. 28 00:04:56.150 --> 00:05:07.360 So I'm gonna answer that by saying I don't think it's extremely realistic, but I don't think it can't be done. So if I didn't have a family right now, I think that we would probably have a lot more revenue. 29 00:05:07.960 --> 00:05:18.020 I think that we would be doing, we'd be in a much better spot. But that's, I guess, so the balance is kind of sacrificing how fast we're growing at Demo to be able to spend time with my wife, to... 30 00:05:18.140 --> 00:05:19.160 Like, we're gonna go get lunch today. 31 00:05:19.240 --> 00:05:28.730 So to be able to go have those lunch dates, to be able to go hang out with Liam and all this stuff when he gets home from school, and not be working till 8:00, 9:00, 10:00 PM or even midnight every single night. 32 00:05:28.820 --> 00:05:36.840 So I don't know, it's like you have to sacrifice one or the other i- in my opinion. Now, one short caveat, I don't wanna waste too much time here. 33 00:05:36.920 --> 00:05:46.960 One short caveat is just the way that the world's going and how easy it is to build applications and lifestyle businesses now. Maybe that's changing, 'cause I don't know how old that... 34 00:05:47.020 --> 00:05:55.050 I think we talked about it a little bit. I don't know how, how old that article was. But back in the day when tech wasn't as easily accessible, you had to go all in, right? Now it's almost like- Mm-hmm... 35 00:05:55.120 --> 00:05:59.740 let me spin up an application in two days, in a weekend. Give me eight hours over a weekend and I'll have a working app. 36 00:06:00.300 --> 00:06:10.392 So maybe that's changed, but I, I really do think that-You can't do it unless you sacrifice somewhere. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I agree. 37 00:06:11.152 --> 00:06:22.462 I think my advice to people who want to join the startups team for the first time and already have a family, or don't have a family yet but want to have a family and wanna jump into an early startup or, or start their own, 38 00:06:23.852 --> 00:06:30.002 understand the risks. I think that's, that's all you can do. And I think to your point, no one can do it all. Yeah. 39 00:06:30.032 --> 00:06:40.672 And so when you start to add more and more to your plate, the only way is to reduce what the time is that you're spending on each of those things. You know, everyone has the same twenty-four hours. 40 00:06:41.112 --> 00:06:51.572 So obviously time management, productivity skills, a lot of hacks to do more than the average person. But at the end of the day, you're gonna have to sleep at some point, you're gonna have to eat at some point. 41 00:06:51.652 --> 00:07:01.732 If you're in a relationship or have a family, like, either you are or you're not present. I mean, there's... You gotta, you gotta exchange something for something else. Yeah. 42 00:07:01.912 --> 00:07:10.112 And one thing you said is no one can do it all, and I also feel like you do a lot, whether you're building a, a SaaS company or not. I do feel like you have a lot of things going on. 43 00:07:10.132 --> 00:07:27.152 Do you ever feel like you can do it all, but realize you can't? I think my wife keeps me really well-grounded. I, I know I can't do it all, and I think-- I try to, I try to have kind of a retroactive look 44 00:07:28.212 --> 00:07:41.572 monthly, maybe quarterly at, okay, what am I doing right now? What's on my plate? And then, and then I separately what, what needs to stay on my plate? What absolutely cannot be taken off? 45 00:07:42.472 --> 00:07:54.662 Let me reprioritize each of those things on the list so that those things that I absolutely need to be there have their time and place in my heart, in my mind, in my day, in my schedule. 46 00:07:55.582 --> 00:08:07.652 I think when I don't do that, and what I see around when you look at people who aren't doing this, it's very easy for things that actually aren't important to take over everything. Ooh. 47 00:08:07.832 --> 00:08:20.172 And I mean, when you start to think really meta about this, like the end of days on your deathbed, so much less matters when you actually look and, and take account of what you've done in your life. 48 00:08:20.212 --> 00:08:30.141 So I, I try to put myself on that deathbed, as it were, not every day. Yeah. That's morbid. Yeah. Yeah. But enough. Enough to be like, what am I doing that's just totally worthless? 49 00:08:30.832 --> 00:08:42.512 And unfortunately, it's a lot, you know? Yeah. Even, even like scrolling for two hours. Like yikes, two, two times seven days times fifty-two weeks times ten years, ugh. Like that's, that's- Yeah... 50 00:08:42.552 --> 00:08:56.492 way too much time to scroll, so, you know. Yeah. Stuff like that. I definitely think that you, myself, most people out there spend way too much time on minute things and things that literally just- Mm-hmm... 51 00:08:56.572 --> 00:09:04.892 don't matter in life- Yeah... whatsoever. And I think maybe it's our generation where everything is literally- Mm-hmm... at our fingertips, so it's just, it, it's- It is... it's almost addict... 52 00:09:04.972 --> 00:09:13.141 It is addicting, to be honest. You get on TikTok, and next thing you know, thirty minutes later you've been laughing and it's fun and entertaining, but, oh crap. Yeah. I have a... I've got a call. 53 00:09:13.352 --> 00:09:24.552 I gotta jump on this call. Um- I know. And so since, since you were talking about deathbed and, and being morbid and all this stuff, I'm gonna continue with the so-called deep conversations here. Okay. 54 00:09:25.492 --> 00:09:39.572 How often do you talk to your parents? Great question. They are local, and so more frequently now than when they-- I, I haven't lived locally with my family in my entire adult life. 55 00:09:40.152 --> 00:09:50.192 Uh, graduated, moved overseas to Madrid, moved to Chicago, moved down where I am now in Charleston, and all the while my parents lived everywhere else, not, not in the same place as me. 56 00:09:50.972 --> 00:10:05.201 Two years ago, uh, maybe three years ago now, uh, they were in Seattle. We were in Charleston, and I had some conversations with them. I said, "Look, you guys are not getting any younger. We are having kids, 57 00:10:06.272 --> 00:10:16.652 and we're currently a six-hour one-way flight to each other." So time change of three-hour difference, six hours both ways. 58 00:10:17.952 --> 00:10:31.072 It was a difficult series of conversations, but I said, "We don't know that I can't count on two hands how many times we're gonna see you if we don't change something." So that, you know, that led to more conversations. 59 00:10:31.472 --> 00:10:46.492 Uh, it wasn't just like a, "Okay, we'll move to Charleston." But ultimately they moved to Charleston. That was deliberate. Everyone's choice to, okay, grandkids are here, children are grown-ups, they're planting roots. 60 00:10:46.532 --> 00:10:56.192 We want to know them, we want to know their children. Let's be closer. And I think that's a conversation a lot of people aren't willing to have with their parents. Yeah. Oh, yeah. 61 00:10:56.352 --> 00:11:08.182 And there are life decisions people aren't willing to make to change their circumstances. And so I talk to my parents a lot, probably, I mean, at least every week I see them, you know. 62 00:11:08.212 --> 00:11:16.332 If not see them, you know, text back and forth, talk real quick, you know, drop the grandchildren off with them. Um, but it was not that way when they weren't local. 63 00:11:16.392 --> 00:11:28.792 I mean, somet- sometimes we'd go weeks without talking, and, uh- Yeah... that's just the reality. Okay. How, how often- Yeah... do you talk to your parents? Um, so my-- So Dad's not in the picture. 64 00:11:29.092 --> 00:11:40.732 My mother, she is in Texas. She's actually visiting soon. And I think that at some point we will also have to have that difficult conversation. So she's now retired. 65 00:11:40.792 --> 00:11:51.532 My wife's family is retired, which is why we ended up moving to Wisconsin. They can be much more helpful. They're fifteen years older. They had kids late, so they don't have as much time as my mother has. 66 00:11:51.552 --> 00:12:07.662 But my mom has this... She's got this expectation that we will visit just about as much as she will visit us here, and I don't think that that is okay because we have two kids, and traveling with two kids- Mm-hmm... 67 00:12:07.662 --> 00:12:17.612 and going, you know, from daycare, school, all that stuff, going there, it's not easy.She's- Mm-hmm... pretty h- now she's, she's worked her ass off, but now she's pretty up, pretty high up in her role. 68 00:12:17.692 --> 00:12:29.012 She can really work from anywhere whenever she wants. She likes to go into the office to set a standard, but, like, she can, she can come here whenever. Um- Yeah... and she doesn't, and there's been weird, 69 00:12:30.172 --> 00:12:34.742 there's been weird interactions. Like, actually last Christmas, I think this might be TMI, but who cares? 70 00:12:35.492 --> 00:12:40.852 Last Christmas, I was like, "Hey, do you want gift cards or would you rather me just buy your plane flight here so you can come see the kid?" 71 00:12:41.172 --> 00:12:48.282 Which was just Liam at the time, and 'cause she's always like, "I don't see him enough," all that stuff, and she's like, "Um, I'll just take gift cards." And I was like, "Uh, that's a little weird." Mm-hmm. 72 00:12:48.282 --> 00:12:54.412 "That kinda rubs me the wrong way because you tell me how much you wanna see him. I'm literally giving you a free trip here." Mm. 73 00:12:54.612 --> 00:13:02.952 Um, so she's coming up in March or something like that, but I do think that we are about to have somewhat of a hard conversation of, look, 74 00:13:04.052 --> 00:13:14.652 I think I can only visit Texas once a year, just about, maybe twice max, but we'll come for a week each time. 'Cause right now my mom will be like, "Come from a Thursday to a Sunday." 75 00:13:14.772 --> 00:13:20.642 Traveling with two kids Thursday to Sunday, you fly Thursday, the whole day is a travel day. Sunday, the whole day- Yep... is a travel day. It's- Yep... it's not worth it. 76 00:13:20.772 --> 00:13:35.472 It's not worth $1,200 to get us there and then- Yep... be stressed out for half of it. All that to say is we talked about, before the kids, we talked maybe, like, once a month. Just like, "What's up? How are you?" 77 00:13:35.632 --> 00:13:45.632 Short conversations too, like nothing, nothing of any sort of context. And ever since the kids, I think once a week now, like, I will FaceTime her and she'll see the kids- Yeah... and stuff like that. 78 00:13:46.072 --> 00:13:56.432 But yeah, I think that we're about to have that, that tough conversation, and that leads me to a question that kind of comes off of that question is how often do you tell your parents that you love them? Hmm. 79 00:13:57.612 --> 00:14:11.592 Yeah, I think I've changed my perspective on this. I tell them probably every time I see them in person. Um, no- That's good. I mean, yeah. Uh, all r- uh, but like a, "All right, we'll see you next time. Love you guys. 80 00:14:11.612 --> 00:14:19.692 Thanks for coming." Yeah, that works. You know? Yeah. It's, it's, it's a, it, it's not like ooshie gooshie, but yeah, I think... I've talked a little bit about this on the podcast. 81 00:14:19.792 --> 00:14:32.212 Uh, for those who follow me outside of the podcast, I've talked a lot about this. My dad had a third heart attack last year. Uh, his first was over 10 years ago now. His second, you know, a few years after that. 82 00:14:32.242 --> 00:14:44.892 His third... You know, you get a call from my mom unexpected now, and like- Mm-hmm... I'm braced. Like- Yeah... is my mom just checking in on me? Uncommon. She doesn't just call me out of the blue. 83 00:14:44.972 --> 00:14:58.472 Usually she texts, and then we c- and then we talk. Calls me out of the blue, like, is something wrong? So I answer it kinda braced. Luckily, my dad is in great health. He's okay. His checkups look great, but I'm like, 84 00:14:59.512 --> 00:15:10.582 you know, you read a- authors all the time say, like, "Hey, you never know when it's gonna be your last time." Yeah. That, that, like, actually resonates with me pretty strongly right now in this season of life because, 85 00:15:11.772 --> 00:15:21.972 parents aside, I, because of these scares, I tell my parents I love them. My- Yeah. I've lost some friends pretty tragically as well. Yep. Um, my roommate in college took his own life. 86 00:15:22.332 --> 00:15:36.062 I went to class that morning, got a call about 30 minutes later. Worst call I've ever experienced by a long shot. I had talked to him- Yeah... asked him if he needed a ride to class. He seemed completely normal. 87 00:15:37.252 --> 00:15:45.601 30 minutes, 45 minutes later, I get a call that he had taken his life. Worst... I mean, I lived that moment, I've lived that moment a million times. What- Yeah, yeah... 88 00:15:45.612 --> 00:15:59.272 what could I have said differently in those moments? Fast-forward to two, three years ago, uh, someone else, a very close friend of mine, totally different circumstances. To, I, I think you're always going... 89 00:15:59.372 --> 00:16:11.432 This is what I've learned. You're always gonna want to have said it more. You're always gonna want to have told people- Yeah... how you felt more than you did. And so I've started to l- just, let me just do it. 90 00:16:11.992 --> 00:16:17.552 I know no matter how much I do it, you're always gonna wonder what if, how could I have done this differently? But- Yeah... 91 00:16:17.592 --> 00:16:28.422 let me at least reduce that chasm because I think for many people, and for myself as well, the chasm's huge. You know, you're gonna lose someone, and you're gonna really wish you said it more. Yeah. 92 00:16:28.451 --> 00:16:40.592 So why not just start now? Yeah. Yeah, I, I don't, I don't say it enough, and I kind of wanna mirror your story about your college roommate because we haven't really gotten deep on this podcast, right? 93 00:16:40.662 --> 00:16:47.642 And so one thing that you asked on the Brian Lamana episode last week, which has been performing amazing by the way, [chuckles] um, but one thing- Yeah, yeah... 94 00:16:47.642 --> 00:16:55.322 that you asked was what is your biggest regret, and I still don't think to this moment I have any, like, true regrets. 95 00:16:55.372 --> 00:17:02.402 Like, sure, you could regret, like, oh, I should've texted my roommate asking if he needed help or anything like that, or I wish I said something more- Yeah... whatever. 96 00:17:03.192 --> 00:17:14.932 But I actually have a tattoo right here, my only tattoo, is from when I was 17. It was me and my best friend, and we got into the car with this drunk driver, and we were both in the backseat, hit a tree. 97 00:17:14.992 --> 00:17:25.492 He passed away, like literally I- Oh my goodness. Such a crazy story, I know. He's so... We all blacked out. I wake up, and he's, like, laying on my lap, and I'm like, "Oh, shit." Like, he's, he's done. Wow. 98 00:17:25.532 --> 00:17:34.952 Um, so when I... A lot of people... And I, and I never ask for, like, sympathy for that because I think that moment has defined every single thing about my life. 99 00:17:35.172 --> 00:17:43.412 For the most part, it's like, holy shit, what if I was in that seat? And I, and I hate even having that conversation- Mm-hmm... because it sounds selfish, to be honest. 100 00:17:43.452 --> 00:17:53.332 Like I, like a lot of people are like, "What if that was me?" And I'm like, "I don't know." So it's just, like, seeing his parents the next day, it's, it's heartbreaking, right? And so- Mm-hmm... I don't know. 101 00:17:53.352 --> 00:18:03.232 There, y- like you said, it's, it's very easy to say I want to tell people how I feel about them more, but I still feel like I lack in that department. 102 00:18:03.272 --> 00:18:11.012 Like, I don't just tell my mom, like, "Hey, I appreciate everything you've done." Right? Mother's Day comes up, she'll get a card and I'll tell her. Christmas comes along, I'll tell her I love her. 103 00:18:11.052 --> 00:18:16.292 Like, and I tell her I love her every time we sign off on a call, but yeah. Yeah. It is, it's really weird. 104 00:18:16.332 --> 00:18:26.588 You never know, and that's-That moment in my life taught me, like, I will never know when it's my, my time to go. So yeah, I think I definitely need to say it more to, to everybody. 105 00:18:26.608 --> 00:18:32.668 And I actually texted one of my friends yesterday. I saw he got a promotion. I was just... And I haven't talked to him in years, but I was like, "Dude, I'm so proud of you. Like, good for you." 106 00:18:32.748 --> 00:18:43.388 So maybe subconsciously I'm getting there, but yeah, there's a lot of people out there that you care about, let them know, 'cause you never, ever know. You never know. 107 00:18:43.558 --> 00:18:55.598 And I think taking inventory of those people, anyone here listening, you know, I recommend write, write, write down a list of 20, 30 people, maybe not even, 10 people, five people, you know? Yeah. 108 00:18:55.628 --> 00:19:08.528 I don't know your life and the, the connections you've made. It could be 100 people. But those that you appreciate, do they know you appreciate them? If not, it doesn't- Mm. It doesn't take much to just- Yeah... 109 00:19:08.588 --> 00:19:19.838 appreciate them vocally. Text them, shoot them a call, voice note. You can do a lot nowadays. But just say, "Hey man, I've been thinking about you. Really appreciate..." And fill in the blanks. Yeah. 110 00:19:19.838 --> 00:19:30.168 "That time you did something. Those words you shared at that moment." It's, it's a big deal. Yeah. It goes a long way, and I think you're gonna feel better doing that than keeping that in. That's huge. 111 00:19:30.268 --> 00:19:42.288 Um, so how do we awkwardly move on to a more bright and [laughs] energetic, enthusiastic conversation? [laughs] I'll, uh, I'll share a story. Let's shift gears. Let's do it. Um, let's shift gears. 112 00:19:42.348 --> 00:19:51.168 So we both work in tech, two dads in tech. Shared with a friend who's in town staying with me right now about the podcast, saying, what is it? Yeah. Well, it's two dads in tech. We're both dads. We both work in tech. 113 00:19:51.228 --> 00:19:59.978 We talk about a bunch of stuff. It's unscripted. We both come prepared with a couple questions to ask each other, but otherwise part of the appeal is that it's unscripted. Yeah. 114 00:20:00.008 --> 00:20:08.668 So in that part of the appeal, I did wanna call back to a question I asked earlier and some things we discussed with Brian in our last episode. 115 00:20:08.708 --> 00:20:18.878 But Troy, for you, someone listening to this podcast right now hates their job, absolutely despises waking up on Monday morning and starting their career. Mm-hmm. 116 00:20:19.668 --> 00:20:31.028 Does not like what they're doing, doesn't like what they're selling, doesn't like the work they're doing. My question is, what advice do you have for that person who just absolutely despises what they do for work? 117 00:20:33.488 --> 00:20:35.977 I love this question, and I feel 118 00:20:37.328 --> 00:20:51.738 as if a lot of people are in this position where they despise what they are doing, or they feel like they despise what they are doing, and so they tell themselves, "If I go to that company, I'll be happier." 119 00:20:51.898 --> 00:20:57.008 And I think that this happens so much. You see so many people, they always think that the grass is greener. 120 00:20:57.097 --> 00:21:02.208 They leave their job, they go somewhere else, they don't hit quota, they work more hours, it's more stressful, they hate their boss. 121 00:21:02.248 --> 00:21:15.788 Like, there's so many other things that c- that can go wrong when you join another company. So kind of like what you were talking about, the risk of creating a startup earlier, I would just, like, lay out the risk. 122 00:21:15.868 --> 00:21:27.228 If you join that company and you despise that as well, like, does that eliminate the ability to possibly move upward in the job that you hate- Mm-hmm... or the company that you hate? So I've only hated one job, just one. 123 00:21:27.588 --> 00:21:28.998 Um, and 124 00:21:30.008 --> 00:21:44.828 I'm glad I got out of it, so I think, uh, if you despise it, if you're depressed, you literally on Sunday, you're like super anxious and you're like, "I, I don't wanna wake up tomorrow to get my job done," that is a, a tall tale sign to start reaching out and looking for other jobs. 125 00:21:45.548 --> 00:21:52.238 Mm-hmm. To be honest, this is so cliché, but grow that network. Just meet a- Mm... bunch of people. 126 00:21:52.868 --> 00:22:03.528 Meet a bunch of people because you won't need to go through the interview process again, because if you hate your job and then you go get denied at 20 other jobs that you wanna work at, you're only gonna hate life even more and you're only gonna hate that job- Yeah... 127 00:22:03.537 --> 00:22:12.348 even more. So the whole your network is your net worth thing, I, I totally believe that, wholeheartedly believe that. So if you hate your job, I would do two things. 128 00:22:12.468 --> 00:22:16.308 One, I would absolutely go out there and start networking with people that- Mm-hmm... 129 00:22:16.428 --> 00:22:27.608 have jobs that either you want or at companies that you wanna be at, or just to be able to get your face out there, your name out there. And then two, I would make it your secondary job to go look for new jobs. 130 00:22:27.728 --> 00:22:33.758 I wouldn't- Yeah. A- again, we're gonna make the specific to tech sales. I wouldn't go out there and blast out a ton of applications. 131 00:22:33.828 --> 00:22:41.578 I would go out there and find companies that look like they're doing well, that the reps are doing well. Maybe even reach out. You can find this on LinkedIn, but reach out to the people- Yeah... 132 00:22:41.578 --> 00:22:53.608 that were previously at that company, ask why they left. Like- Yeah... it's almost you, you'd have to make it your second job to- Mm-hmm... go and find another job. But the grass- Yeah... is not always greener. 133 00:22:53.728 --> 00:23:00.398 You can go to that place that you dreamed of, and you can absolutely hate it. So that's kinda like what I, what I think of, of jobs. 134 00:23:00.528 --> 00:23:11.148 Like, do you just wait it out a little bit longer, or I mean, like I said, if you're that, that depressed about your job, like, just, just leave. Yeah. Yeah. 135 00:23:11.268 --> 00:23:24.198 It's, uh, the question came from a story I discovered, uh, that you've probably heard about. Have you heard of Boom Supersonic, the company? Hold on. And he was at Groupon? Yes. The founder. You've heard of him. 136 00:23:24.198 --> 00:23:30.338 Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. So- Yeah... this guy, Blake Scholl, if I'm pronouncing his last name- Mm-hmm... 137 00:23:30.758 --> 00:23:48.478 he was at Groupon for, you know, a number of years, worked his way up into a product exec, uh, role, and ultimately jumped ship and founded a, like, physics-based supersonic high speed, like, mainstream jet company. 138 00:23:48.588 --> 00:24:01.688 I, I, so different from Groupon product that, like, it's unbelievable. But it's funny because Supersonic just broke the sound barrier, so this guy from- Wow... Groupon founded this company, they broke the sound barrier. 139 00:24:01.748 --> 00:24:08.948 They're trying to make mainstream, or they're trying to make high-speed air travel mainstream. But it's funny you bring up Groupon. 140 00:24:09.588 --> 00:24:25.068 His LinkedIn profile shows two years in Palo Alto as senior director of smart deals, relevance, and personalization at Groupon, which is, like, the most random thing ever for someone who'd, like, discovered, like, high-speed mainstream flight or whatever. 141 00:24:25.088 --> 00:24:35.774 But-The description of this that he wrote, it says, "There's nothing like working on internet coupons to make you yearn to build something you truly love." And so- Yep... 142 00:24:35.824 --> 00:24:41.384 when I asked you the question about, hey, someone hates their job, what should they do? I think there's one caveat, and I think you'd agree with me on this. 143 00:24:41.984 --> 00:24:57.854 If you hate your job, but there's actually something you're so passionate about and really good at doing, go find how to do that. Yeah. It might not be starting a high-speed air travel company with jets and stuff. Yeah. 144 00:24:57.863 --> 00:25:09.964 Like that's unique. Yeah. This guy's clearly on a different plane of intelligence than a lot of us, but it might be a side hustle, a consultancy. It might be starting a newsletter. 145 00:25:10.044 --> 00:25:13.304 I talk to people about that all the time. Like g- give yourself a way to create. 146 00:25:13.844 --> 00:25:23.684 Uh, it could be something like a podcast or it could just be finding a new job that's so different than what you're doing now, but leans into what you love, leans into the- Yeah... 147 00:25:23.774 --> 00:25:32.674 skills you've developed over experiences and, and just life stages. But I think hating your job- Yeah... is a good sign to figure out what do you like and what are you good at? 148 00:25:33.114 --> 00:25:41.394 And then j- uh, trying to figure out how to do those two things together. So say somebody has... I, I did see that by the way yesterday, uh, the Boom Supersonic guy. 149 00:25:42.424 --> 00:25:54.484 Say that, uh, this person that you're talking about that hates their job, and you're saying, "You know what? Just go do what you love." Like it's so easily said. Let's say this person has limited resources. 150 00:25:54.564 --> 00:26:03.764 What would you advise them to do to start what they love if they like playing guitar or something like that, and they can't leave 150K OTE or whatever it is? What would you say to them? 151 00:26:05.884 --> 00:26:14.024 I think the internet gives you more opportunity than we have ever had in the history of mankind. 152 00:26:14.864 --> 00:26:24.104 Uh, I know guitars was just one random example you pulled out of thin air, but I know a friend of mine who has a YouTube channel. He, he's crazy good at guitar. 153 00:26:24.324 --> 00:26:34.114 I don't think he has a massive following, but every single time he plays his guitar at home, he's also on YouTube Live. I don't even know if anyone's watching. Mm. 154 00:26:34.114 --> 00:26:41.444 My friend called this friend the other day for just a conversation, needed some help with something, and he's like, "Yo, just join my Live. We'll talk there." 155 00:26:41.614 --> 00:26:51.704 [laughs] So instead of a phone call, they hung up, and he just hopped on YouTube and talked to him on his YouTube channel live, and there was like no one there, but it's just like what he does in his pastime. Yeah. 156 00:26:52.224 --> 00:27:01.744 So I think if you wanna start doing something that you love and you're not sure how that turns into money, my, my suggestion is start doing what you love, 157 00:27:02.764 --> 00:27:14.364 and you will probably be surprised about how you can turn it into revenue. Yeah. I mean, there's always- Absolutely... there's always a way. Yeah. There is. I have a friend, one of my best friends ever. 158 00:27:15.464 --> 00:27:25.914 Since he was a kid, he loves gaming. Loves it. Even to this day will still rip Fortnite, Call of Duty, all of it. Love it. Loves gaming. He went on pat leave. 159 00:27:25.944 --> 00:27:34.544 He got a 12-week fully paid pat leave, and then he started streaming, and he ended up getting thousands and thousands and thousands of followers after he started streaming. 160 00:27:34.664 --> 00:27:40.384 Um, I, I kinda texted you about this guy yesterday. I was like, "Yeah, I got... I helped him with TikTok," whatever. Yeah. Right. This is the guy. 161 00:27:40.404 --> 00:27:47.544 So started getting thousands of followers, and then when he, when that 12 weeks ended, he went back to work, stopped streaming, and like that's what he wants to do. 162 00:27:47.584 --> 00:27:54.924 He wants to be a full-time streamer, but now he's got this kid. He's got a full-time job that he can't just like step away from in the middle of the day like he did on pat leave. 163 00:27:55.364 --> 00:27:59.284 So like he works, he gets off, he takes care of this kid. I'm like- Mm... 164 00:27:59.293 --> 00:28:11.064 "Dude, you, you were on this trajectory where if you just kept doing it for three, four months, once a day or five days a week, like I think you could've made it your full-time gig." Yeah. But- Yeah... 165 00:28:11.084 --> 00:28:25.864 he stopped a little early, and I'm like, "Ah, gosh, I wish that would've just made his dream come true," but yeah. Do you remember the, the mindful and demure TikTok? Oh, yeah. I saw, I saw a TikTok from that person, um, 166 00:28:27.164 --> 00:28:41.944 maybe a month after that went viral, and they just... It was like, like no makeup, no script, nothing video of that person looking in the camera and saying, "Just do the thing." I have this- Yeah... 167 00:28:42.024 --> 00:28:53.924 absolutely idiotic video about being mindful and demure that went bonkers viral and completely- Yep... changed my life. I quit my job that week. 168 00:28:54.524 --> 00:29:04.774 I've gotten billions of views and clicks since that went viral, brand deals like I've never dreamed of, just from posting something that I easily could've- Yeah... 169 00:29:04.774 --> 00:29:16.104 convinced myself not to post because it was so silly, but I posted it. Yeah. And so for those people out there like, "Where do I start?" Just do it. Do the thing. Uh, uh- Yeah... somewhere for someone to see. 170 00:29:16.664 --> 00:29:24.424 Things go viral right now in ways that you just can't comprehend. It's not like playing the lottery where it's like one in a billion or one in 100 billion chance. 171 00:29:25.184 --> 00:29:34.984 It's like a lot of people actually are going viral, and their lives are changing overnight from just doing something that they could have chosen- Yeah... not to do, but they chose to do. Yeah. 172 00:29:35.004 --> 00:29:42.544 And that's why I post a clip every single day of "Two Dads and Tech." Mm-hmm. I'm like, I wonder, 'cause there's a lot of podcasts that I now follow on- Yep... TikTok specifically. 173 00:29:42.604 --> 00:29:50.954 I don't even listen to them on Spotify, Apple, YouTube. I just make sure- Yep... that I watch their TikToks, and you're, you're right. I mean, Hawk Tuah, we talked about her long- Hawk Tuah. That's right... 174 00:29:50.984 --> 00:29:59.204 like I don't know, first episode maybe. Yeah, yeah. She made millions. She made millions off of somebody interviewing her while drunk. Insane. And now she's like in prison maybe? Not e- no, she... 175 00:29:59.264 --> 00:30:08.394 I saw that she- I can't remember... so that, that whole scam happened. I don't know really, I don't know the conclusion of it, but I did see that she- Yeah... jumped back onto the podcasting scene last week or something. 176 00:30:08.394 --> 00:30:15.664 Oh, okay. That's good. That's good. But, uh, whatever, whatever. Um, this is actually a good time to, to shout out the sponsor. Um- Let's, let's do it... 177 00:30:15.704 --> 00:30:25.844 has nothing to do with Hawk Tuah or making your dreams come true except for if you hate your email client, then it will make your dreams come true. Our sponsor today is Superhuman. 178 00:30:26.044 --> 00:30:31.584 It is the best email client that sits on top of Google, so you don't really work out of Gmail. 179 00:30:31.644 --> 00:30:41.628 You actually work out of Superhuman.Easiest way to go through your inbox, easiest way to create events, easiest ways to update HubSpot, Salesforce, easiest ways to get snippets, respond to emails. 180 00:30:42.168 --> 00:30:47.448 Everything is done essentially with AI at this point, and then you have hotkeys that sit on top of it. 181 00:30:47.948 --> 00:30:54.038 So you literally just need to press one button on your keyboard to go through your emails, remind you to respond to an email later. 182 00:30:54.068 --> 00:31:02.928 You can search up any phrase, any term, any word, and it'll use its AI to automatically surface those emails back to you. So if you're like, "Oh, what did that person say?" 183 00:31:02.968 --> 00:31:12.428 But you know they said something about money, type in money and it'll surface every single thing that has money directly to the top of your inbox, but with the context behind it. 184 00:31:12.468 --> 00:31:18.668 It'll give you like a one-liner, a little paragraph of what that email said, summarizes all your emails. It's amazing. 185 00:31:18.828 --> 00:31:32.268 And honestly, the reason why I love it so much is it is the fastest email client that I've ever used in my life. So creating an email, CCing people, attaching an image, attaching a file, whatever it is, super fast. 186 00:31:32.468 --> 00:31:44.498 Extremely fast. I love it. I will never go back to the normal Gmail client. I'll use it forever. Go try it out. Oh, if you use our code or go to, what is it, superhuman.com/twodadsintech, go there. Okay. 187 00:31:44.528 --> 00:31:54.468 Free month on us, and if you have questions about it, hit me up on LinkedIn. I'll literally sing to their praises because, again, it's my favorite tool that I have in my tech stack. But- All right... 188 00:31:54.508 --> 00:32:09.388 superhuman.com/twodadsintech. Go there. Yes. Try it out. Yes. I love it. I also use Superhuman, and I can confirm everything that Troy just said. Incredibly fast. Please go try it out, superhuman.com/twodadsintech. 189 00:32:10.008 --> 00:32:22.088 Um, let's see. What do we have here? I got something for you. Go for it. Cool. I wouldn't say this is a deep question, but I do wanna hear your thoughts on it. 190 00:32:22.128 --> 00:32:33.648 And before I explain my outlook, I wanna ask you a very simple question: Do you think life is easy? Hmm. No. No. Okay. Definitely not. Cool. All we needed to hear. So 191 00:32:34.888 --> 00:32:36.568 I was talking to a lot of people, and they were telling me all... 192 00:32:36.828 --> 00:32:51.288 Like, just through selling Demo, and they were telling me all about like, you know, kids' struggles, family struggles, business struggles, all of these things. And I have this idea that life in general is, 193 00:32:53.008 --> 00:33:02.987 I wouldn't say bad, but it's definitely chaotic. It's a mess, and to be honest, it, it... kind of bad, right? Like, a, I would say typically more bad things happen. 194 00:33:03.048 --> 00:33:13.028 I don't know, this may be, this is just my thoughts on it, but my whole thought is, okay, life is in general just extremely chaotic. It's extremely messy. 195 00:33:13.048 --> 00:33:23.318 But how you make life good versus bad all comes down to how you respond to things that happen in your life. So like, your kids had, um, walking pneumonia and w- I can't remember. Yeah. 196 00:33:23.408 --> 00:33:31.168 Like, they were both sick, everyone was sick, but it's like- Yeah... we can take this and our lives can be horrible right now, or I can be like, "You know what? They're gonna get better soon. 197 00:33:31.208 --> 00:33:39.748 Let's just make sure that they're healthy." Like, I think it's a whole mindset thing, so I'm curious. Do you think life in general is chaotic and it's based on how you respond to the chaos? 198 00:33:39.908 --> 00:33:51.528 Or do you have a completely different outlook on life? Hmm. I think life in general is chaotic and full of 199 00:33:53.108 --> 00:34:10.168 serendipity, full of what goes around comes around, but, but truly full of random chaotic events. And part of maturing as a person is learning how to react to things that can't be prepared for. 200 00:34:11.408 --> 00:34:19.748 Mm-hmm. So it could be as much as like a loved one getting cancer, and as simple as getting caught in traffic when you're on your way to a timely appointment. 201 00:34:20.568 --> 00:34:36.368 How you respond to things that you couldn't have possibly controlled from happening, I think is what sets apart mature people from immature people. I love that answer. That was the most perfect answer. 202 00:34:36.948 --> 00:34:46.898 [laughs] And I wasn't even prepared. I know. I had no preparation. All of this. Does that mean I'm mature now? Mom, are you proud of me? [laughs] Let's, let's talk about maturing real quick. Yeah. 203 00:34:46.898 --> 00:35:01.008 I see you have a gold chain on. Ooh. So I've been asking Courtney, who's my wife, if I can get a gold chain for, for like, I don't know, a long time. Yeah. And she's not like, "No, you can't." 204 00:35:01.188 --> 00:35:09.788 Like, that's not how my wife is. But she like, she like hesitates for a second and is like, "Dang it," like, "You, you're not gonna like it." [laughs] So I just like, I just like shy away. 205 00:35:09.808 --> 00:35:16.388 But I brought it up the other day. We went on a little date. I had a... We have a new babysitter who lives in our neighborhood, which is incredible. Ooh. So we just like- Let's go... 206 00:35:16.408 --> 00:35:27.678 call her up, she comes over, we go out. It's awesome. Uh, but our date was going to TJ Maxx and just walking around together. That's what dates are like, guys, when you, uh, have two babies- [laughs]... 207 00:35:27.688 --> 00:35:37.708 and you barely get to go out, is like just go to TJ Maxx. So w- the, uh, at TJ Maxx there's like the, the idiotic, you know, like jewelry section. I was like, "Babe, I could get a chain." 208 00:35:38.188 --> 00:35:47.188 And for the first time ever since I've asked that question, she was like, "You should." I was like, "Ooh, who is this girl?" [laughs] So no, I did not buy my chain at TJ Maxx. 209 00:35:47.368 --> 00:35:58.248 I actually did a step up and bought it on Amazon, so you'll be proud of me. [laughs] But I am wearing my chain. Uh, I feel like a new man. 210 00:35:58.308 --> 00:36:06.828 It's like when you get a haircut, you walk out of the barber and you're like, "I can literally- Oh, yeah... fight a lion right now, and then go out- [laughs]... with my wife for a nice steak dinner right after." 211 00:36:07.188 --> 00:36:16.148 That's how I feel wearing my chain. I'm just, I'm just built different. I'm just better. [laughs] Dude, and if I'm not mistaken, that shirt's from TJ Maxx. Is that from date night? That's right. 212 00:36:16.688 --> 00:36:27.888 My whole drip is from date night, is from TJ Maxx. [laughs] It's, it's- Let's go... yeah, it's complete... I did, I redid my whole wardrobe with $10 TJ Maxx shirts. [laughs] Dude, I love that shirt though. 213 00:36:27.948 --> 00:36:35.688 I, I love- Thank you. I love like it... Does it have buttons or is it just kinda like a, a slight V? No, no, just straight up. Ooh. Straight up s- yeah, yeah. No, it's, um- You have chest hair? I'm, I'm bringing it back. 214 00:36:36.088 --> 00:36:46.254 Oh, I do, just a little bit. Just a little bit. Oh, dude, I'm- Not enough to call home aboutUgh, my [laughs]-- I used to trim my chest hair to make me look- Oh, man... more ripped and shredded. Yeah, I know. 215 00:36:46.384 --> 00:36:53.714 [laughs] I shouldn't say this, but I was like, "Oh," like, "I look so lean when I don't have any hair on my chest." And I, like, I have a healthy amount. Um. Yeah. 216 00:36:53.874 --> 00:37:04.904 Um- And then my now wife, then she was my girlfriend, oh my gosh, I got roasted- [laughs]... by her. Like, because you have to keep up with it, dude, right? Or else it gets extremely- Yes... prickly. It was a process. 217 00:37:04.964 --> 00:37:12.364 It was a- Yes... disgusting phase of mine. I thought I was stronger when I shaved my chest hair, but- You're stronger- Whatever... when you don't. No. [laughs] I know. You're stronger when you don't. I know. 218 00:37:12.484 --> 00:37:25.364 Now I'm a man. Now I'm a man. Hilarious. Yeah. This is a good podcast. I feel like we, we don't have many episodes yet like this one where we, we got a layer deeper. We, we went, we went a bit deeper. 219 00:37:25.624 --> 00:37:39.634 And for anyone who's just now li- listening to this podcast who never has, Troy and I actually met for the first time as part of episode one. I'd like to say it's the first podcast in history to do that. 220 00:37:40.364 --> 00:37:52.164 I'd probably be right. I think that's a pretty unique thing. Yeah. Never met before until we actually pressed record. Anyways- Yeah... this is a deep podcast. Dude- Go ahead, Troy. Yeah. You have a question? Yeah. 221 00:37:52.264 --> 00:38:01.154 I thought we haven't gotten that deep, and I always wondered. There's actually two things I've wondered, but I always wondered, like, will we get deep? And I, I knew at some point we would. Yeah. Did I think- I knew... 222 00:38:01.154 --> 00:38:09.764 that it was gonna be today? I had no idea. But I, I did wanna bring up something 'cause you just talked about starting this podcast. We're called Two Dads in Tech, 223 00:38:10.684 --> 00:38:15.184 and when we were talking about names you were like, "It could be Two Idiots, Two Dads in Tech." 224 00:38:15.224 --> 00:38:25.284 And realistically, like, the, the name that we came up with was, like, Two Dads in Tech Talking About Things You Think About But Don't Talk... It was a very long-winded title, which I still love that idea. 225 00:38:25.324 --> 00:38:37.664 I think it's hysterical. Same. Same. Do you think we'll ever step away from the in tech? Two Dads? It, it... Yeah. Like, or Two Dads- I think there's-... something because I feel like we're narrowing our, our reach. 226 00:38:37.674 --> 00:38:44.524 Like, hey, you have to be in tech to listen to this, and that's not the case- Yeah... whatsoever. Yeah. Uh, I think there's, there's a chance. 227 00:38:44.964 --> 00:38:58.544 Uh, y- you think of someone like the Colin and Samir show and Morning Brew Daily I think are two ends of the spectrum. You know, Morning Brew Daily is connected to Morning Brew's brand. It's- Yeah... 228 00:38:58.584 --> 00:39:05.004 Mor- it's effectively Morning Brew, but as a podcast, and obviously they discuss different things in the flagship newsletter. 229 00:39:05.084 --> 00:39:16.844 Uh, but then you have Colin and Samir who may just be with a guest, maybe together, but it-- the, the brand is Colin and Samir. And I think- Yeah... there's, there's something to both. 230 00:39:16.884 --> 00:39:27.864 You know, right now we are Two Dads in Tech, who we are Daniel and Troy. I don't know. It could... Daniel and Troy- Yeah... Show or the Troy and Daniel Show. Like, I, I, I... Anything's possible. Yeah. 231 00:39:28.244 --> 00:39:37.244 Two months ago we didn't know what we were doing, and now we're a, a fully-fledged business model. So I... Anything's possible. Yeah. 2025's gonna show us a lot of new stuff. Yeah. Like, 232 00:39:38.164 --> 00:39:48.504 I agree with you, and, and I was thinking, like, you can't go 100 episodes in then just change your entire podcast name. I know. And I was like- Yeah... but I don't wanna change the name. It kinda has a good feel to it. 233 00:39:48.564 --> 00:39:54.994 Like, we, we have this niche where people want to tune in because we're in tech and stuff, but, um- And I think... 234 00:39:56.804 --> 00:40:05.074 I was j- I mean, Two Dads in Tech as a title doesn't necessarily mean that only people in tech listen to it, you know? I, I think- Yeah, that's true... 235 00:40:05.104 --> 00:40:19.744 I think how we, how we approach branding and positioning, what we talk about, I think will be louder than the title itself. I think what's nice about Two Dads in Tech is it's unique because of who we are. 236 00:40:19.784 --> 00:40:28.924 We are two dads and currently are in tech. And even if we're not in tech down the line, like, we'll talk about tech in some facet- Yeah... or be connected to that in some facet. 237 00:40:28.984 --> 00:40:36.904 But TDIT kind-- everything kinda rolls off the tongue. Yeah, I don't know. It's a great question. Yeah. Now I'm gonna start thinking too much about it. I know. 238 00:40:36.944 --> 00:40:44.824 Yeah, I'm gonna get like 16 texts from you later like, "Dude, should we name it this? Should we name it that?" [laughs] Yes. Uh, like, dude, slow, slow down. We're good with Two Dads in Tech. 239 00:40:44.864 --> 00:40:56.513 In my opinion, we have one minute left here. That's a great way- Mm-hmm... to sign off, Daniel. Agreed. Two Dads in Tech, where can they find us? You can find us on TikTok and Instagram- Mm-hmm... 240 00:40:56.513 --> 00:41:04.554 on handle twodadsintech. So please go watch those videos. That's where the virality happens. Also, on YouTube, please click the Subscribe button. 241 00:41:04.604 --> 00:41:16.464 If you're r- listening to this right now, you've probably seen a little Click Subscribe graphic a few times. Please do subscribe. That helps us a lot. Like, follow on Spotify and Apple. Give us a rating. 242 00:41:16.944 --> 00:41:30.124 Uh, twodadsintech.com if you're interested in sponsoring us. You can get in touch with me, daniel@twodadsintech.com. Um, I think anywhere Two Dads in Tech is, is where you're gonna find us. And so please do find us. 243 00:41:31.164 --> 00:41:35.514 Awesome. Daniel, thanks so much. It was great chatting. Troy, always is. Talk to you soon, man.