Hey, Troy. Welcome back to another episode of Two Dads and Tech. Hey, buddy. How are you? I'm doing well. Hey, before we jump in, I wanted to give a quick shout-out to our sponsor of today's episode, Momentous.
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Thank you, Momentous. Uh, I do want to just start with a rapid fire here. Mm. Troy, do you think- Wait... the number of close friendships- Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. Stop. Before you- Okay... go.
Just so everyone knows for context, I literally just went on a run. I leaf blowed... Leaf blowed? Leaf blowed. Leaf blow, leaf blew. You look, you look nice though. You don't even have to explain.
Oh, dude, my shirt's so... No, but I'm saying that because- You look, you look like you prepped... Daniel was like, "Yo, you wanna jump on now?" As soon as I was making a protein shake.
Actually from Mome- well, we'll get onto that later. But- This is what happens. Troy- Dude, I- Troy tries to riff- I wasn't [laughs]... and he just can't. He's- I know... he's still outside running right now. I [laughs]
go. Do you think how many friends you have in your 30s is a good indicator of long-term happiness? With this rapid fire, are we... Is it yes, no, or is it like- No... let's expand? Tell me. No, expand. Go ahead.
Let's not even call it rapid fire. Shouldn't have even said that. Okay. All right. No, no worries. Ask it again. Do you think how many friends you have in your 30s is a good indicator of long-term happiness? No.
No, I don't. Why not? I, I was gonna answer it as like rapid fire. Um, no, I don't. Uh, but I do think friends can make you happy. I don't think...
I mean, there's some people who could care less about friends and care more just about like family and keeping their community close of, you know, family, et cetera.
I am one of those that thrive off friendships, and I'm one of those that thrive off like being able to go hang out with a group of people, and the kids are playing around, they're having a good time.
So I think friendships are extremely important, but I don't think it's a requirement. Like, some people just don't want to. My mom is, I think she's happy, she seems really happy, but zero friends, dude. Zero friends.
She's not in her 30s, but she also didn't have friends in her 30s either 'cause she had a kid at 17. And I don't know, some people just don't really care too much about friends.
Like they don't have enough, they don't have enough like social tokens to give out to friends. It's interesting- But for me, it makes me happy... I feel like the way... Yeah. I feel like the way you're answering it
is delineating between extroverted and introverted people. It is, for sure. But, but I don't know that being introverted or extroverted has any say with whether or not friends are- Make you happy...
a nece- a necessary component of long-term, I said happiness, but really long-term health. Like, can you go throughout life being as healthy as possible?
I'm not saying can you survive, but is it healthy to not have friends? Yeah. And I guess it depends on what you, what you mean by friends. Do you mean friends by hanging out or do you mean like a- Confidence...
like a support system I mean, confidence. You know? Yeah, a support system, someone to lean on, someone to cry on. Yeah. Okay. It doesn't need to be 40 people, but one or two good ride or dies- Yeah...
seems like, it seems like it's objectively better to have that. Oh, for sure. But... Okay. For sure. So you and I here are agreeing. I'm agreeing with that.
I just don't think it's requi- so like support system and friends, like I see some of my friends l- I guess if you wanna b- really break it down to the technicalities, maybe it's my support system because I like hanging out with them and it helps my like mental clarity, happiness, things like that.
Yeah. Like, yeah, I guess if you really wanna go that far, you can. You can make it a stretch.
But like I see a support system as a little bit different than friends, but your friends can obviously act as your support system. But maybe- That's true... your support system is your dog.
Maybe it's your support system is your grandma. You know, like, so I don't know. You can- Yeah... you can get so technical with this, but I, in my...
I'm gonna, I'm gonna, I'm gonna revert back on my immediate answer and I will say like I do believe that friends make you happy and can make you really happy. Mm-hmm.
But I s- again, I don't know if it's, I still don't know if it's a necessity. Yeah. Um, yeah. No, I think, I... And, and the, the question was does it have an indication on your long-term happiness?
My answer would be yes, because I think there will be exceptions. People like you mentioned your mom, and there's people who like they're, they're well into their 50s, 60s, 70s. They might not really have friends.
They probably have a fair enough support system, so they're okay, they're happy, they're fine. But it, it's like you look at someone who's 30, 31, 32. Let's, let's paint a picture. Mm. Yeah. They have...
Maybe they're married, maybe not. You know? Doesn't really matter. They just don't have any social life. They work. Maybe they play video games alone.
Not talking online video games, 'cause there's those people out there, "Oh, those are friends." Yeah, I get it. Those are friends. Like whatever, do your thing, video gamers.
But I'm talking about you're playing campaign mode alone. Whenever you have free time, you scroll TikTok. You have no social life. Yeah, yeah. You're... You, you will cope and figure out how to be fine.
I believe there are, unfortunately, I believe it's unfortunate, I believe there are unfortunately a lot of people I'm describing right now. But I, I gotta imagine...
And there's, there's likely a lot of science behind this. I didn't do the research, but I could probably find the science to back this up. I am... I've gotta imagine that one, two, three deep,
vulnerable friendships are going to make that person I just described better in the long run. Maybe even, a- and again, did not do the research, but I would, I would bet-Increase their longevity by years even.
I think that support system, those friends probably add years to your life, and not having them, I think reduce your life by potentially years. Yeah. I w- I would agree with that.
And I feel like we should call this podcast General Paint- Paintbrush because we always like, every, every conversation- [laughs]... we have, like, we wanna
i- and it's 'cause there's so many- We just wanna, we just wanna get- There's so many caveats... we wanna get the full, but, like, everything has a caveat. I know, everything has a caveat. It's annoying. It's annoying.
That's fine. Um, but anywho. So- I agree. You general paintbrush people with friends and people without friends, I 100% agree that there's probably science behind those people being happier, maybe more successful.
Again, the success is subjective, but also could increase their longevity in, in life. So I do agree, general paintbrush, yes.
So you just, you just moved to a new city, and, uh, so I really actually am interested in your response to this.
If you had to move right now to a city you've never been where there is no family and you have no friends, how would you create, uh, let's call it a village? How would you- Yeah, yeah...
make a new support system, group of friends, like, social life? Let's call it that. How would you s- how would you start a new social life with your wife and your kids in a brand-new city you've never been? Yeah.
So we're kind... I know we've, we've... My wife grew up where I'm at now, but we're kinda doing that now, actually. It's funny enough that [laughs] my wife and I get home, so there's this...
Uh, I won't say names, so there's this girl at daycare that is really good friends with Liam, and they, like, love each other. And the mom, like, I, I s- it's the mom that drops off.
Actually, let's open this up 'cause I wanna pick your brain. The mom drops the kid off every day. I drop Liam off every day, and, like, we talk, and we're like, "Oh," like, "Oh, they're, they love each other," whatever.
Yeah. I wanna ask her, "Hey, we should hang out after daycare," but that's weird coming from a guy to just- It is... a female. It is. So my wife and I have literally, like, we'll come home, and we'll be like...
And she'll go, "Did you make us that friend?" And I'm like, "[sighs] Like, no, 'cause it's weird." How do you... Yeah.
So we've, we've been strategically, like, ju- just make it blunt, like, "Hey, look, this is really weird. My wife and I are somewhat new to the city, um, and we're trying to make new friends. It's hard as parents." Yeah.
"And typically I wouldn't ask a mom to hang out, but, like, can I get your husband's number?" Yeah. "And, like, maybe we can schedule something for the kids to play," 'cause we know that the kids like each other. Yeah.
And so I've been battling this. It's literally so relevant right now because it's- Yeah... the last four days that we... I come home, and I'm like- Yeah... "Oh, I didn't see her," or it was just a quick- So funny...
"Hey, hey, bye." Um, so d- like, that also answers the question.
That's one thing that I would do, is if your kids are in daycare and if you have kids, that's the number one place you should look is- Break the fourth wall. Yeah, break the fourth wall, but how do I do that?
So let's open it up here, and then I'll- So-... continue with your, your- I-... question.
I love that I'm in South Carolina and you're in Wisconsin because the way I would have answered this when I lived in Chicago is completely different than the way I answer this right now living in South Carolina.
The vibe around just going and getting someone's number in South Carolina, dude, I can do it with anyone of any gender, of any race, without weirdness. Yeah. And I, I do.
And I think that about Wisconsin, 'cause Midwest- Okay... people are nice. I do think that, but I still feel- I said Chicago... weird socially. You don't do that in Chicago. No, you, you...
[laughs] I wouldn't do that in Chi-Town. No way. Yeah. No.
Um, so it's funny, yesterday I had, uh, I took my kids to the park, and I ran into a girl in one of my kid's classes and her mom, and I, I knew them because, you know, w- same, same class for two years now.
Like, I, I had, I had kinda run into them a few times before. And it's just, it's just not weird, but I've seen them before with Courtney. So in the instance where I hadn't been with Courtney,
yeah, I think w- here's, here's just straight up the playbook that I would do. Like, "Hey, look, we're in a new town, and Courtney and I love having people over.
We love getting to know new friends and, and just making friends for us but also for our kids. Can I get your number? And I'm gonna just pass it to Courtney, and we're gonna reach out-" Mm. "...
and have you over for dinner sometime or-" Yeah, yeah. "... you know, go out, get, get something where the kids can run around." That's, that's easy, simple.
Either they say no, which honestly takes more guts being like, "No, that's weird," than just saying yes. Than asking. [laughs] Yeah. Then the onus is on me to not be weird, but I do it to so many people.
I'm like, that's just... I- Yeah... I always tell people, I joke around, I'm like, "If you are socially awkward, you will not be allowed to be socially awkward with me." I just, I, I'm...
I talk to anyone of any flavor a- just how I am. Yeah. Yeah. Um, I think it's partly because of how I was raised, and I moved around so much to so many different types of cities. But yeah- Yeah. Yeah. Okay...
I mean, I would just do that. Just call a spade a spade. "Look, this is weird. I wish my wife was the one in this conversation, but she's not. Can I get your number? I'm gonna pass it to my wife.
We're gonna set up some time if you're open to it, but I'd love for our kids to be able to hang out and for you to be able to meet my wife. You're gonna love her." Yeah, yeah. That's exactly- Yeah...
the line I would use. Okay. "You're gonna love her." All right. "Make it all about your wife. You're gonna love her." That's what I would say.
If I say it, uh, if I see her today, I'll do that, and I'll let you know how it goes. But- Yeah... I've, like, slowly been ramping up the conversations. Yeah.
Like, "Oh," like, "He was talking about, you know, y- your daughter or whatever on the way home today." Yeah, yeah. Whatever. So anyways, one's daycare. Two, another way I'd make friends.
Again, we're gonna just talk about general paintbrush, you have a family, you have, you know, kids, 'cause you did say, like, there's no family and stuff like that around you. So,
uh, yesterday we went to, every Thursday in Verona, which is the town that I live in, there's music in the park where it's just kids that run around, there's music, and they have, like, free popcorn- Those are great...
all that stuff. So that's another way to make friends.
So if you're listening to this, um, what, what we did yesterday was we went there, we saw this group of, like, three parents our age with kids very similar to Liam and Harrison's age.
And so then I just kinda let Liam go play with the kids a little bit, and then I, you know, inserted myself in there just a tad. And the next thing you know, me and this guy started talking about golf. I got his number.
Yeah. And, like, we texted last night, and I was like, "Yo, let's go play some golf next week." So we're gonna golf together, so that's another way- Love it... to make friends.
When we were in North Carolina, we did move with a kid, no friends, no family, zero, absolutely nothing. My wife had the guts to actually post on Facebook. It was a new build neighborhood, by the way, so- Yeah...
just to let you know- Those are great-... it's a new build neighborhood... for- Yeah... for kids. Those new build neighborhood Facebook pages- Yeah... they're phenomenal. Yeah, they are.
So she was just like, "Hey, this is really weird, and typically I wouldn't make a post like this, but we just moved here.
We have no friends, no family."She ended up going on a walk with, like, 13 moms, and next thing you know- That's crazy... we have our, we, we talked about them, Sean and Ashton, on the last podcast.
We have a, a yearly trip with them now. So we went to the beach this year. We already scheduled our beach trip next year. Love it. We'll go to Virginia with them. They're coming here next year for s- in September. Like,
we just met our friends through Facebook. So I'd say social media... Well, at the end of the day, being uncomfortable is how you make friends.
Like, you gotta put yourself in that weird situation, which is what I just brought up to you. Like, I feel weird asking a mom to hang out with, with me.
It's like, obviously I'm not asking in that kind of way, but it's just a weird, it's a weird thing, you know? So. It is. But, but yeah, that's how. Do you think our kids... Yeah. I love that response.
Do you think our kids will ever have the same types of friendships that we had growing up? And here's what I mean by that. If your childhood was anything like mine, you'll understand. I grew up getting home from school.
I had a little plastic ramp I would pull out from the garage. Oh, yeah. And I would skateboard, and people would come over with their bikes and scooters and rollerblades.
And, like, it was the same group of, like, 10 kids, and we would play football, and we'd be tackling each other. It was guys and girls. People would be tackling.
It was, like, elementary school, like, just having the time of our lives. Someone would have a swing set, and we would play outside so much, so much so that I have PTSD from my grandpa, who recently passed away.
Rest in peace, Grandpa. RIP. Um, he said, "You know what? Go outside." And I was like, "I don't want to go outside. It's hot." He's like, "Well, that's what you're gonna do today. Go play outside."
And, you know, I'm talking when I was, like, six, seven, eight years old. We went to Grandma and Grandpa's house. Like, we played outside, and if you didn't have anything to do, you figured out something- Yeah...
to do outside. But the neighborhood kids growing up, like, that's... My memory of childhood is, like, that is what you did. Do you think our kids are gonna have that same type of childhood? That's a good question.
That's exactly how I grew up, too. Plastic ramp. Yeah. We all met at my friend Jake's house. That's what I'm saying. We played football in his lawn. I would say, general paintbrush, uh, no, just because- Sure...
there's so much tech embedded into our life. But I- So much... I wouldn't, I wouldn't take away the aspect of, like, playing outside and stuff. So we live on a, on this little lake where kids like to fish.
So we had, like, these 12-year-olds probably come up to me, literally in my driveway, "Hey, can we go to your backyard so we can go to the lake and, and fish?" Oh, that's cool. And I was like, "That's sick." Like, I...
My wife was like, "No. Like, we don't wanna be responsible if anything happens to them," whatever. And I was like, "If I was 12, I would've done the same thing." Like, I, like, I feel nostalgic.
I feel like I miss those days. I'm gonna let them go back there, so I let them go back there, fish and things like that. She's like, "Just don't let it happen all the time." Um, and they haven't come back since.
They actually just kind of go back a different way. But anyways, I saw that. I see these kids across the street that are biking outside all the time, like, through... I live in a wooded area. Yeah.
So they, like, bike through the woods, and that's another thing I probably would've done. And so- So cool... so I'm not... I would say, like, yes and no. I still think playing outside and stuff will be pretty big.
And I think that there will be more of an emphasis for kids to play outside once we realize how poisonous tech really is to our lives. Um- Yes. So- Do you think there will be a comeback because of that?
Like- Yeah, yeah... we in our, specifically our generation, I think you and I are kind of at the, the forefront of technology exhaustion. I don't know what else to call it. There's probably a word for it.
But we're like, "Good grief. Like, everything is technology." And we're starting to implement even these, like, Sabbaths in our lives, and, like, disconnect days and disconnect hours. I just downloaded Opal. I wish...
Not Opal. O- what is it called? Um, I'll come back with that. I think it's Opal. Yeah, Opal. Have you heard of Opal? It's the app where you, like, disconnect from life for periods of time. I, I'll come back to that.
Yeah. Anyways- I thought it was, like, Brick, but I don't know. There's Brick. Brick is, like, a s- is a hardware you connect with your phone. But, uh, I think we're- Oh, okay...
all to say we're, I think we're getting back to that. To wanting to disconnect, yeah. We're almost in the cycle where, like, we're at the end of the cycle where it's like- Yeah...
yes, AI is ramping up tech use, but I think in the same way that it's ramping up tech use, people are getting exhausted. Yeah. Like- Yeah...
we can't keep 10X'ing our tech development every day f- forever without something breaking, and if nothing breaks, it's [laughs] gonna be us. We're gonna break. Like, we can't, we can't, we can't take it anymore. Yeah.
So I do think, yeah, I think it will kind of reverse things back to a time where I, I think kids will want to go and play outside. And I think the parents more so will kind of like what your grandpa did.
Like, "No, you're gonna go play outside. You're not gonna sit here and chat with ChatGPT all day. Like, that's, that's just not what you're gonna do."
And then when I even, like, when I scroll TikTok, I'll see, you know how sometimes you just see videos of like...
This sounds weird, and it's not weird, but, like, you'll see, like, 13-year-olds make videos of them golfing. Uh, they're actually... Do you know the MB Foodie Boys? Gabby? Oh, um, yes, I do.
So, like, they're- Gabby Golf... they're kinda, like, just friends. Same, same thing. So anyways, yeah. And then there's, like, little golf...
Like, there's this group that was, like, it's, like, probably 13-year-old boys, and they're like, "I'm this name. I'm this name. I'm this name, and we're gonna make golf videos until we hit 10,000 followers."
And overnight they hit 10,000. And they do it, like, immediately. And then- I know. Yeah. And then it was, like, 50,000. It was, like, a hund- And anyways- Yeah...
it was, like, that's stuff I would've done with my friends. But, like, now they just have tech embedded into their life. Like, so, like- Yes...
when I see videos of, like, kids of whatever age, I'm like, "I did that, but I just never publicized it." So I still think it's there right now.
I do think there's more people probably, sadly, like, depressed, anxious, things like that, and addicted to technology. But- Yeah... uh, yeah. I, that, I, I- So- Yeah... Opal is the name. Okay. Uh, I just confirmed.
So I just, so I, I told you in a previous episode, and you and I have talked a bit offline about the app I vibe coded offline. Yeah. It's called Offline. Yeah, yeah.
Um, and I, I got it to a steady launch of, like, an MVP, and it worked and stuff. But in my research, I discovered this app called Opal. It is incredible. I downloaded a free trial for a week, and it's $100 a year.
I'm going to pay $100. Ooh. First day, I saved 86% of screen time that I would have otherwise used according to what it says I have already done every day for h- uh, you know, the whole usage of my iPhone.
So you install it on your iPhone-It is, it locks every single app you have that you want, that you want it to lock. Like you tell it, "Hey, these are the apps I don't wanna use during these periods of time."
So I have 9:00 to 5:00 blocked off, and then I have like the late night blocked off, early morning blocked off, just as like a, a benchmark.
And what happens is you can override it, just like with the usage times on your iPhone that it's built in. But to override it, you have to go to the app, and it forces the seven-minute...
or sorry, seven-second time where you have to breathe. It says, "Breathe in." And you breathe in. You don't have to breathe, but it says, "Breathe in," and it's just this countdown.
And then after, it says, "Are you sure?" Dude, I have said nevermind like five times. There should be like six are you sures. Like are you really, really sure? [laughs] No, I know. It just does one, but it just- Yeah.
Yeah, yeah... it's just enough of this time where you have to like, "No, I don't need to do this." That's nice. And then if you do override it- That's sick...
it has a one to 15-minute like timeframe that you can take this break. But something about it, there's like, it's like gamified, so like you, you unlock new gems. Apparently Opal is like a, a gem.
It's an opal gem, and so there's these different gems. It's, it's so simple. Okay. Interesting. Yeah. It's exactly what I envisioned for this Vibe Coded app, that I'm just like, "Forget that."
Opal figured it out, and apparently there's 100 million, I was gonna say users, 100 million hours saved so far. I don't know how many customers they have. That's sick. I, I cannot recommend this app enough.
I, I immediately, day one, told it to my wife. I was like, "This app is gonna change my life." I, I actually, I wasn't doing research. I s- found it on Instagram while I was scrolling. The ad was so good.
The ad said something to the effect, it was like this, this like World War Z type of thing where it's like, "Your iPhone is your enemy." And I was like, "What the freak?
Is this like, you know, I don't know, a conspiracy?" And it, it basically got to the point where it's like, "Apple, Apple is, you know, infiltrating your brain."
It was, it was supposed to be very conspiracy-esque, but at the end it said, "Get your time back. All you have to do is click here." I was like, "Bump this. I don't even care if I'm getting brainwashed right now."
I clicked it. [laughs] Dude, the onboarding was so good. I can't say enough good things about Opal. We need to get Opal to sponsor the podcast. I was gonna say, this isn't a sponsored ad, by the way, everyone.
But- This is not a sponsored ad... but it sounds like one, and it sounds great. [laughs] I don't know anyone at Opal. I'm- Yeah. Oh... so anyways. We gotta hit 'em up.
Uh, I think that type of tech is going to be the future, because more people are gonna feel more depression and inundation from just the need to use tech, that when they don't need to use tech, they're gonna be, "What am I doing?
I've been staring at a small screen, a medium-sized screen, and a big screen all day, and now I finally have free time and I'm staring at my small screen in my bed at 11:30 PM at night." Yeah. Good night. So- Yeah.
Do you-... I think we're, we're gonna feel that...
when we grew up, I feel like, at least my mom and stuff, they put like timers on the TV to where it would shut off after a certain time and, you know, parental controls- Yeah... and things like that.
Do you think just like when parents gift their kids iPhones, like the first iPhone, or just like, "Yo, by the way, whether it's Opal or something else, like we're gonna make sure that you cannot use these apps at these times 'cause we want you to be socializing."
Yeah. I'm assuming that's probably the easiest way to kinda get 'em off. They're- I'm sure there's things like that already, but. Yeah. Gabbe? I think it's G-A-B-B. I'll have to look it up. Is it an iPhone?
Is it a whole phone, like- It's like a, it, it's a, it's a hardware. Yeah. Yeah, it's a hardware. Yeah, yeah. I've seen that. You know that guy? Yeah. The Gabbe. He used to work at Nike, Gabbe Tech or...
Um, I've talked to him a couple times. It's like a phone, right? Like a kid's phone. Yeah. Like the first phone they- It looks like an iPhone, but it- Yep... is designed around kids' use. Yep. I saw.
And so, you know, my kids obviously don't have phones yet 'cause they're too young, but I've thought through like what will the first phone look like, and- Yeah...
I don't think too much about it 'cause like by the time they have one, it'll be so far- So different... in the future, who knows what, you know, will exist. But- Yeah... yeah.
Like when I grew up, my, my parents, a lot of times were like, "Hey, before you play video games or watch TV, like read a book." And like, "Here's, here's, here are the books to choose from."
And like that was a rule on, on, not every day, but on a lot of occasions. Like, "Here's a book." Uh, you know, I read the Bible growing up, I read, you know, all the, uh, Harry Potter, Lord of the Rings.
Like you just pick up a book, read it for 20 minutes or something, and, "All right, yeah. Did, did you read a book? Okay, cool. Go ahead, watch TV."
Or like, you know, "You can watch TV for this amount of time, but then you gotta go outside and play." Like there's, there's like a lot of built-in systems- Yeah... that worked, that worked for us.
Something you just said was, "I read the Bible growing up." Mm-hmm. And I've always wanted to ask you this, and I haven't. Did you grow up religious? It's a very interesting story. I'll get into it for a moment.
Yes, I did. When I was nine, 10 years old until the time of maybe 15. 15 is when I decided, like, I'm gonna follow Jesus and be a Christian. That's what... I was 15. When I...
Before that, growing up, I just kinda went to church, and my parents were Christians, and I, you know, I was Christian by proxy, but like really it was just 'cause I was a kid.
I was like, "Well, am I really a Christian?" You know, we can get into the theology of that.
For about four or five years in there, I was very rebellious and did not want to do or have anything to do with Christianity, with people who called themselves Christians.
Um, and that was the same period of life that I was getting, I mean, just like in all sorts of trouble. I was- Yeah, yeah... kicked out of schools, kicked out of several schools.
Didn't finish middle school, didn't finish high school. Uh, you know, went to a private school for delinquents in ninth grade.
Like just straight up, like that's where delinquents went who didn't fit into regular school systems. Um, and so it was rough. Uh, it was not cause and effect, like, oh, that's 'cause you weren't going to church.
Like, no, I wasn't going to church 'cause I was, I was angry at- Yeah, yeah... the world, uh, my family, myself. Lot of depression in those days. Um,
and so yes, I grew up religious, but I think for a lot of people, oh, yeah, I grew up religious, like,
I almost don't wanna categorize myself in the same way because while I did early years, in those teen years, those were the formative years-The reason I came back, that was my decision, because I was gone.
I mean, I may, I may as well have been in a completely different universe than a, a, you know, Christianity bubble. And because it was just rebellion. And so, you know, and I, I said the word follow Jesus.
Christianity as a, as a word, as a term, has such a, a, a bad connotation today. It- it's, it's a little bit sad to me, 'cause I've, I've studied history, philosophy, theology at the graduate level. I've written books.
Uh, I've taught and preached and done so in different languages all over the world, and I think what the world thinks a Christian looks like is just not what history says Christians should look like.
And so it's a tough balancing act. Yeah. But I do love the Bible, still read it. Yeah. But yeah. I know you're religious now, and I know that you always talked and hinted at a troubled past, so I always wondered- Yeah...
if, you know, a lot of people... A- and I didn't grow up religious at all. Um, my family outside of my house family is pretty religious. My house family, my mom was kinda like kicked out.
She had a kid at 17, and she was labeled as like a screw-up in the family. Yeah. So she kinda just- Yeah... went off on her own. Yeah. So I, I never really grew up too, too religious at all.
And so I ask that because I know a lot of people have, like, their come to Jesus moments, and I was wondering if you either grew up religious and then you had, like, you had all this troubled past and you're like, "Okay, I need this come to Jesus moment."
Call it what you will. A lot of people, you know, I think- No... kind of like have- It's spot on... you know. Yeah.
So I didn't know if you, uh, if you had a come to Jesus moment or if you, like, grew up religious and then just became more. I don't know. I, I wasn't sure- Yeah... like, where, uh- A bit of both. Okay.
I had the foundations. The foundations were built early on. Yeah. But I also had to have my own moment, uh, which was certainly a series of moments. Um, I was just damaging people's lives. I mean,
uh, there's, there's no better way to put it. I mean, I was, I was destroying people's lives, uh, with my words, with my actions. It was bad.
If I had continued down that path, without a doubt I would either be in prison or dead right now. Yeah. And that's not even- Jeez, dude... an exaggeration. 100%. Yeah, it was just- We'll, we'll- No, no way around that...
open up at some, some point. Yeah. 100th episode. Yeah. 100th episode- Yeah... we'll get super deep. Yeah, we can celebrate- Yeah... we can celebrate two years with- Yeah...
you know, all the things that I probably don't wanna be on the internet. [laughs] But at that point we'll be, we'll be doing just fine- Yeah... with this podcast. We'll be rich and famous. Yeah, yeah. Exactly. So famous.
Yeah. All right. No, so- What's, uh-... I'm always open to talk about any of that.
Uh, I think more people need to, because I think not enough people like me do talk about it, and that's why the word or term Christian has this, a stigma. Yeah. It does.
You know, there's so many things that it means that it doesn't actually mean, because so many people that do associate with it and are very loud about their association also have all these other [laughs] things about them, and I'm like, "That's not- Yeah...
that's not what this is supposed to look like or, or be about," you know? Yeah. That's a tricky world, man. Tricky world. It's kinda like you're walking on eggshells and, and- Yes...
yeah, I think that there's a lot of, uh, there's definitely a lot of outside stereotypes for sure. There are. And, and, and no one... It's not like they're blind to it. It's pretty, uh- No... it's pretty out there.
Um- I'm hyper-aware of the association people label me with when they hear that I am someone who reads the Bible and tries to follow the words of Jesus, and, you know, I, I can't get around it.
I'm not gonna not follow Jesus because of how people associate me with the people who I think are probably not supposed to be wearing that badge. But then I also don't wanna judge people. I'm like, look, it's hard.
Although we can get into a lot of theology. The Bible actually, and this is a, this is opening a can of worms. The Bible tells us to judge those who are wearing the badge of Christianity. We...
I'm not gonna, I'm not gonna talk a lot about that, but we're supposed to. Not everyone. Hey- Don't judge people who aren't. But how else are we supposed to know- Hey... followers of Jesus except by judgment, you know?
Anyways. Honestly- Boom... regardless of, take, take religion out of there, it's hard not to judge. [laughs] I'll be honest. It is hard not to judge.
It's just the ju- You walk out in public and you're like, you look at somebody like, ah, you know, you'll, you might make a judgment- I mean, judgment, it, I think people confuse, like, judgment as, like, the, to judge your perception of something and passing judgment of like, "Oh, you suck."
Like, that's not what judgment means. Like, that is a form of judgment and you shouldn't do that. Yeah. But, like, you have to judge to, to know what to do in a situation, what's right and what's wrong.
Like, everything requires a judgment. So I think there's, there's a lot of valid, or validity there. If you disconnected from technology completely for 30 days, would your career take a nosedive?
So, like, I can't work because I work on technology, is that what you mean? Maybe. Ooh. You tell me. Ooh. No technology at all. Um, every th- penny I make today- Every day...
every, every penny I make today is off of technology. Um- So how much would you have to be given cash money post-taxes to completely eliminate every form of electrical currency in your life? For my entire life?
I guess- Or just for these 30 days? Yeah, that's a great question. Um, so I would- That's two different-... for 30 days... two different amounts. For 30 days. Let's start for 30 days, because if- Not much...
what doing that for 30 days means for after. I mean, so that's really the question is, like, if you eliminate it for 30 days, like, can you just come back and start at 31? Probably not. Yeah. I mean, not much.
I- if, if I needed to make do without technology to provide for my family, I'd... Literally, if you took out technology, the next six seconds- Like a lemonade stand...
I'd walk, I'd walk to every single neighborhood near me and ask if I can mow their lawn for 40 bucks. Like, I would just do that. So easy. And I'd- Yeah... I'd go make money. Immediately. Like, I'd... 100%.
So, yeah, I would do that. I would, um- I might make more money doing that for those 30 days... honestly, I probably would. It'd be harder work. I mean, we sit behind a computer and press keys. 100%.
But I would go mow lawns, and then after I mow the lawn and they give me their payment, I'd say, "Any other house chores I can do for you?" And then I would just start, I'd just start getting- Cleaning the gutters...
chores. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Little, little window cleaning. Little windows. Love that. No, there, there's so much opportunity to make money out there, it's just like, do you really want to go do it?
So to your point, how much money do...
Like, if you were like, "Hey, I'm gonna give you money for a 30-day challenge," I don't know, give me, like...Give me like some money to, to pay for daycare and my mortgage for a month and then I'll figure it out.
So give me, who knows, give me 10K and I'll, I'll go figure it out. Okay. Okay. I was thinking 10K too. Yeah. Now what about for the rest of your life? Can't have any technology. You can, you can like be around it.
Like if you go to a restaurant, there's a TV there, like okay, that's fine. But like you- So what if I wanted to like reach out to you? I, I just can't? Mail.
[laughs] I mean, dude, we- we've evolved so much from that, like to the point where that's, that's almost out of the question. So how much? How much money? No, it's not out of the question.
If, if I- How much money makes it in the question? [laughs] Uh, um, okay. So literally [laughs] now you're changing this. I can't talk to my mom without mail.
I can't hang out, tell, ask my friends if they can hang out without mail. Yeah. You are basically Amish. Okay. Without days off. Yep. All right. For the rest of your life. Um, the rest of my life.
Dude, that needs to be a lot, and at that point does money even matter if I can't buy technology, if I can't buy stuff with it? Like... I don't know. That's, that's a great question. What, what would I buy?
I don't know, maybe- Like am I allowed to go on planes? Is that a technology? That's a technology. Can I go fly to- That would be, that would be a technology. Oh.
You'd have to take a, you'd have to take a kayak to Europe. Wipe me out, dog. You know, I don't care about the money. I'm done. [laughs] Just kill me now. Yeah, just. Oh, man. I'm, I'm done. No, I literally- Oh...
I don't know, 'cause the, like if I sat in my house I, I'd figure out how to make things work, right? So then- Like you can't buy a house without technology. I know. I know. You can't go on a vacation. I know.
So if I were to just be like in the woods, no tech, I don't care about money. [laughs] So then, then the question is how long could you go in that level of zero technology? Today, maybe about one to three months.
Um, take out like family and stuff like that, I'd be able to like... I'd be, okay, is this a technology? [laughs] Like are you telling me I have to cook my food and like make a fire with sticks and like- 100%. 100%.
Yeah. No, dude. No, we're, we're talking- Yeah... straight up- Give me a month, dog. [laughs]... before electricity was invented. Okay. A month. Yeah.
I'm, I'm good for a month and then I need to go make some chicken nuggets and stuff or something- 100%... to hold me over. Yeah. Yeah. [laughs] I could not- Yeah... I couldn't do it. Two weeks? I don't know.
I don't know. Yeah, no. I- I'm, I mean even like the term- You're taking away everything. Like you're taking away like- Yeah... even like your standard living stuff, which is not fun.
That's what I'm saying, like camping, like I went camping once. Once and I'll never do it again. [laughs] No, no, no, no, no. I've, I've been camping many times, but I went camping once where I actually rode my bike.
I, I, I used to do a lot of road biking back in the day and I rode my bike with a friend about 25 miles down the road to this like very remote area. We had our backpack and enos, which are like a hammock. Damn.
And it was like 100%. I mean, we had our phone, so like that would've been, we'd have to get rid of that. But beyond that it was like actual off the grid. What'd you eat?
We, we made a little fire and I think we had like a grocery, like some... This was like 10 years ago, but I think we had like some, some easy stuff to eat, like that, in our backpack.
So you had to go to the grocery store and use technology to buy it. That's what I'm saying. The, the- Yeah, like- I'm saying this is the closest I can remember being to zero technology, and I still had technology.
Yeah, yeah. Okay. So I'm like, yeah, having literally no technology and being like extremely strict about it- Yeah. I don't know, man. Not gonna do it. That'd be, that'd be a different type of level of, uh- No...
of disconnect. When I was doing that TikTok live thing, I might have said this in an earlier episode, I tried to do it for 30 days. I got to like day 12 and it, it started to weird me out.
But when I was doing it I spoke with, I had somebody on my live, uh, she was just like popping in every day, and she was, uh, younger but she was a, an Amish that escaped her Amish family and like told, kind of like exposed like the whole Amish thing.
I've seen that before. It was, it was crazy. But it's- Maybe not that person, but I've seen those, yeah. Yeah, it's crazy. Like the actual stories- It is... behind.
And, hey, if you're Amish listening to this you're not really Amish. But if you are listening to this [laughs] just kidding. Uh- I bought, uh- I don't know what to say. I don't-...
Lacey, my, my dog, my Bernedoodle, was from an Amish breeder. Ooh. And yeah, in like the middle of nowhere Illinois. We drove like two hours to get her and it was like very- Yeah?... Little House on the Prairie.
Does that ring a bell? Yeah. Yeah, that's for sure. I feel like that's what it felt like. Yeah. I was like, "Oh, wow, okay." Like it was pretty cool. Yeah, these, these cabinets are from modern Amish.
All my cabinets are Amish cabinets, but they drove here with the cabinets, so I'm like, okay, you kind of believe in it. Right. I know. But... I know. There's like, it's like modern-day Amish. Yeah. Yeah.
There are some, but- What do you think about- Yeah. I was gonna say, what do you think about legacy? My packages. Yeah, I hate these rapid fire things. Um, let's see. I love them. Legacy.
I don't, I think if, if you want me to give you my rapid answer, what I'm immediately- I do... thinking about it, I think people try to act like you need to leave a legacy a little too much. Um- Ooh. Yeah. Dig in.
Dig in. Yeah. Let's talk about Gary Vee's Har- Hormozi, whatever, Hormozi, whatever his last name is. Alex Hormozi. Yeah, that's his last name. They all just act like you need to leave a legacy. Yeah.
So I guess, uh, we can unpack it more. What do you mean by legacy? Like a legacy within your family or to the public eye? Like those are two different things. Um- Both. What do you wanna be remembered for?
But also- Yeah. Okay... what do you want your kids to carry on? Yeah, yeah. Um, so I wanna be remembered for... Like and that's what I'm saying, like what does... My direct family, like being a good dad, being like...
I mean, I think that's like the biggest thing, being a good, good dad, being respectful, always being willing to like just, say like last night my, my son was kind of annoying me, just as sons do at, at three years old.
Yeah. But I sat there and he was like, "Daddy, can we do X, Y, and Z? At this point it's bedtime." I was like, "You know what? Yeah, we can do that," and I let him stay up a little later. Yeah. Why not?
And I was like, "Let's go do that." Yeah. Because it's like those kind of things, like, so I think I just wanna be remembered for that. Like I'm kind of goofy and quirky. I think you, you know that. Same.
And I know you are as well, so it's like- Yeah... like he was fun, he was happy, he was respectful, he was kind, he was a good father. You know, he treated the people around him well.
He, he always brought people around them up. Like I hate when people are sad, and I actually get really awkward when somebody cries and stuff 'cause I don't know what to do. I, I kinda like clench up. So I don't know.
I'm always in there. I always try to like brighten it up with a joke, even though it's usually not the right moment, but whatever. Yeah. So I think that's it like from a family perspective. Yeah.
Public, I, I don't really care what that [laughs]... It's gonna say what the hell anybody thinks of me outside of my family when I go. [laughs] Yeah. They're- I, actually I'm, I'm thread- Alex Hormozi threaded something.
One, real quickly. Alex Hormozi threaded something the other day and it said pretty much like nobody will remember you six months after you die that's not your family.And like, that's pretty true. You know?
Like, nobody will really care about you six months after you pass away. So yeah. Yeah. I don't know. I think there are very few people in the grand scheme of things who are remembered long after they pass.
Um, like Abraham Lincoln all the way to Kobe Bryant. Like, th- those two people will be remembered for obviously very different things, but for a very long time.
Abraham Lincoln probably even longer than Kobe Bryant, to be honest. I mean, you just- Yeah. But I don't know that I care at all. Um, uh, I do care about the family. Like, if I died tomorrow- Yeah...
I wouldn't want my family to just immediately forget me. Yeah, yeah. But like, if I died tomorrow, I don't think I would care if everyone on LinkedIn just moved on. Like, I just...
[laughs] Like, that, that part of my life just means so little to me. Good. You shouldn't, dude. No, that's what I'm saying. But, um- Yeah, that's what, that's what I'm saying...
yeah, legacy- Like, people like Hormozi, Gary Vee, like, I think that, I think there's like, there's the, there, there's too much glamorizing building a public legacy these days. Um, and it's cool.
Like, don't get me wrong. Like, I'm sure that if you did it, you'd probably, I don't know, you'd probably be pretty happy at that point, have a little bit more pressure on you. But I, I don't know.
Like, I think there's so much push, like leave your legacy, build your legacy, go do this right now, which all good in theory, but u- most people can't just go do what they want today and be happy with life.
Like, that's, we're not, we're in a system, y'all. We're in a system, and we gotta work and gotta pay bills and all that stuff. So, um, yeah, I don't know. I think there's too much glamorizing, like, a public legacy.
Sometimes I wish... Like, I get very meta about this, but like, why can't we just do whatever we want in life? Oh, dude. You know?
Like, we're, we're so, we're so strapped, we, you and me, but we just like, as a species, we're so strapped, like, to the market that we live inside of.
You can't do whatever you want because, like, eventually you will be homeless. That is, if you literally just did whatever you want, you either become homeless
or are a billionaire, and that's why you do whatever you want. Yeah. Money is, money is such a... Why can't we just barter?
Like, that's what hu- But then immediately things become commodities, and you become a more expensive barterer because you have corn and no one else has any. You ha- you know? It's like, I don't know, man.
You know, just, I, I just wish the, the, you know... I was reading like, would you rather wait in a high growth startup for a possible IPO or keep switching jobs to make more and more money?
And that was a, that was a question I read earlier, and I'm like, "Why can't I just do whatever I want?" Like, why isn't that an option? Like, I- Yeah. Someone, someone's figured this out. Yeah, dude.
Like, if you, raise your hand if you're doing whatever you want. And I think there are people that have figured it out. Even, but- There's a- People, like, they're rich- Keith Lee. Keith Lee, for example.
He, he eats, he's a food review guy, and all he does is go places, eats food, and makes a lot of money, and he's doing what he wants. He literally just eats food. Like [laughs] Oh, you talking about the old guy?
He's like super old? No, no, he's not old. He's, he's a younger guy. Oh, oh, oh, oh, oh. He's got dreads. Keith Lee. Keith Lee, Keith Lee. The one that does the zoom in. Yeah, he's like- Yeah, yeah, yeah...
I, I'm gonna rate this food from one to 10. I forgot his last name. I'm gonna try it. Yeah. Like, whatever. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Um- No, I love Keith Lee...
doing whatever he wants I forgot his last name. And then there's another guy that lives on, like, Turks and Caicos. He's like a 20-year-old kid. Yes. And he does boat tours, but he loves the ocean. Yeah.
And he's like, he's do- Like, there are w- But can we do that? No, we have kids. Like, I actually do see a family on TikTok- Okay, so-... where they have their boat, their, the whole family of four on a boat. Yes.
And they just live on a boat, and they travel the world. Yes. But I don't know how they make mo- Oh, they make money from TikTok, so like, and YouTube. So it's kinda like, I don't know.
Like, I think you can, but it's like, what are you willing to sacrifice? And like, what changes, like, extreme changes in your life are you willing to make to do that?
You know, like, I don't wanna go live on a boat forever. [laughs] No, I don't. I don't know. Maybe for like three days. Do you wanna just start recording two episodes a week and just call it a day? What if we just...
You know TBPN? Just start it as like- You keep saying it to me. Please. I don't know what it stands for. Please. Please. For everyone here listening, w- w- we have- TBPN? Oh, God. Tom Brady? Oh.
Um, um- Troy is, everyone here, uh, when we first started this podcast, I had no idea how uncultured Troy was. We had a listener reach out to us this week and was like, "Troy, I had no idea how uncultured..."
Like, he didn't know the thing with IPO. With, with news y'all. He's never heard, he's never heard of LinkedIn. Podcast, like, he doesn't even know he's on a podcast right now. I had to, I had to put the mic in his room.
No, I'm just kidding. This is Zoom. No. [laughs] TBPN, TBPN is very popular tech podcast. It is, it is like- What does it stand for?... sacrilege. Do you even know what it stands for? It's sacrilege.
I have no idea what it stands for. I guarantee you they probably don't even know what it stands for. No, it's probably tech- Tech bros... tech something, tech something. T- uh, dude. They're exploding.
Very well done podcast. Started out kinda like Two Dads and Tech, which I love every- So do you wanna copy them a little bit? No, no, no. I'm saying the, the, the growth trajectory is one that I think- Yeah...
is worth looking at, is- Yeah, yeah. For sure... like, they started out side hustle. Both of them were, like, they had their own company. They were, like, employees somewhere.
I'm not exactly sure what they did before, but I remember the announcement of I'm going to start doing more episodes. And dude- They blow up?... they have to be doing eight figures at least now.
I mean, they have an ad read at the beginning and end of every short form. They have, like, 20 logos scrolling at the bottom of every episode. Like, their ad placement- Yeah. Yeah, yeah...
is through the roof, but they're, they're leaning into it's a show. It's every day, so we can't do it, so maybe- Are they remote or are they in person? I feel like there's a very big driver if they're in person.
I don't know. They're, they're, uh, they're always on different screens. Okay. Hold on. They have the same setup, but, like, that's- Uh...
that's achievable in remote environments, but they always have a guest who's not there in person, and their guest lineup is insane. It's really what's driving it. So they have, like, everyone.
Uh, like, but it's every day from like 9:00 to 3:00 or something, just a show. Like, they just... I think they're probably in the same room, to be honest.
You gotta look at TBPN, but all I'm saying is, like, that-Sounds awesome. And they just, they're just doing what they want. Interviewing people. Yeah. So- Probably making crazy money.
Here's what I'm, here's what I'm willing to do. I'm willing to do two a week. Coming out with them Wednesday, Friday, Monday, Thursday, Tuesday, I don't care. I'd want them to be shorter, 30 to 40 minutes.
And then I'd want us- I was thinking-... to be able to come out with them, like within two days. Yes. And so what I would want is for us to stay on top of all the news, which I'm starting to read more.
Not like, I guess not fake news- You have to. I need, I need you to just get on Twitter- But like parenting news-... and start looking at stuff... and tech news.
Well, I, I'm starting to subscribe to a lot of newsletters. One of them I actually really love is Cyber Man. Good. All AI stuff. Very draft. Yeah. Um, but anyways- So-... I'm down.
But we would need to like know- Structure... and that's me, I would need to know what in the world- Yeah... is going on in the world. [laughs] That is 100% on you. I'm, I- Dude, I disconnect.
Out- outside of work- I know... I disconnect. Um, anyways. You just have to, you just have to... M- Here- here's, here's the... If we, if we run with this, here's what I'm thinking.
One episode a week is with a guest, and we can, we can get help on guest, you know, acquisition. Like, people can help us build a guest list. That's, that's the least of my concerns.
One episode a week is us responding, just the two of us, to that guest episode. So basically, the two episodes work together. One is the interview itself, and the other one is like our de- debrief- Okay...
our decompression of that interview. And we can- So become more interviewee. Well, no. What if we like, what if we don't have a guest one week? Is it just us talking for two episodes? I assume- I think that's fine...
we make it work. I think that's fine. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. But I think we could probably line up...
I mean, if we, if we get someone to help us with the guest list, we could probably line up the next 26 weeks of guests in a week. I mean, maybe not a week, in a month.
But we could always be four to eight weeks ahead of the, ahead of the curve. There's something to be said, and we should be. Like, we schedule guests like, "Hey, are you available in two hours?" Yeah.
"Are you free this afternoon?" It's like, uh- Um, I will say- Like, we're very lucky that's worked... there's something to be said. All of our guest episodes have three to eight X the views than our normal episodes. Oh.
So- No, I have to... We know that's the right strategy. It's just more work. Yes. And the reason Two Dads and Tech has worked to date is because it's not a lot of work [laughs] for us to do it. Yeah. Yeah, yeah.
Uh, case in point, I asked you five seconds before this recording if you were free to record. That's what works for us, because you and I are both extremely busy and have very little bandwidth. Yeah, yeah.
But I think there's a way for us, and just like we've done with our podcast team. We're doing 250 pieces of content this month. Yeah. That's absurd. That's- that's crazy. Yeah.
And do you know how much work you and I are putting into it? Four hours total. Four hours a week or- And those four hours-... months. Sorry. Three and a half really. Three and a half hours. I mean, 45 minute episodes.
Yeah. Not even four hours. Yeah. So anyways, let's chew on it. Uh, if you're listening to this and you made it this far, thank you for, uh, listening to Two Dads and Tech.
Thank you for reaching out and telling us that you like our episodes. We get DMs more and more every week. Uh, we love those. Please let us know.
Email daniel@twodadsintech if you're interested in sponsoring, uh, the, the podcast. We also have sponsor placements open in our newsletter that goes out every week. Go to twodadsintech.com, check us out.
Um, let us know what you think. If- if you think we should do more episodes or less. Maybe you hate us. Maybe you're just like, "Hey, I actually hate Two Dads and Tech.
I, I made it this far only because of the, the burning passion I have for you to stop recording." But we wanna know that too. But, uh, thank you, thank you to everyone. Troy, do you have any signing notes here?
Any last thoughts? No, no last thoughts. Thanks for, uh, thanks for listening to this episode. I actually really, really liked this episode. So did I. But now I'm like, I'm, you know, I got my wheels spinning.
I'm like, "Okay, who am I gonna reach out to?" Like, we should book four to- Same... four to eight weeks out. Like, right- We'll- we'll try to have a plan... by this weekend we should have- Yeah...
we should have four to eight guests. We have a guest, we have a guest next time we record. I'm very excited about that one. All right. Let's not tell everyone who it is yet. It's gonna be great though.
Should we start the structure then? Yes. Or should we wait? Yeah? Oh, no. No, no, no. We should wait. We need to chew on this and it needs to be done well. We can't kind of do this and kind of not do it.
That's basically what we're already doing. We're already kind of doing this, kind of not doing it with just Two Dads and Tech as a company. [laughs] So we- Yeah. Yeah, yeah.
The next step needs to be either structured or not taken yet is my opinion. Yeah. Would it still be... Now we're just talking. If you're here, like, you can go. But would it still- Enjoy the conversation.
[laughs] Would it still be, um- Hit subscribe, though. Hit subscribe. Go to YouTube. Oh, yes. Please do.
If you're listening on Spotify, if you're listening on Spotify right now, go to YouTube and subscribe to Two Dads and Tech. I don't even care- Almost to 500... if you watch us on YouTube.
We just need, we just need more subscribers on YouTube. Yeah. Please help us out. We're desperate. Um- Literally. Dang it. What was I gonna say? Um, so, oh, would it be, like, still the same tech and parenthood vibes?
I don't know. Or- Let's talk offline. All right. Let's end the episode, 'cause I gotta go, you gotta go. I gotta go, yeah. But this is a great conversation we need to keep having. Troy, happy-