WEBVTT

1
00:00:00.100 --> 00:00:10.240
[upbeat music] Hello.

2
00:00:10.300 --> 00:00:24.060
This is a conversation that I had with Christian Mücke, the creator of the Possible Conference that's in Miami Beach from April 27th to 29th. The Rebooting is happy to be a media partner of Possible for the event.

3
00:00:24.140 --> 00:00:39.040
Thank you to the team there. We'll be around the Font & Glue doing a video series, probably by a pool. So if you see me holding a TRB branded microphone, say hello, or at least don't mock me while we're filming.

4
00:00:39.120 --> 00:00:51.020
I hope to see some of you in the lobby area and around the pools. Drop me a line if you'll be in town. We're gonna get some people together for an informal meetup. My email is brian@therebooting.com.

5
00:00:51.440 --> 00:01:04.980
Now, here's my conversation with Christian about building events. All right. Welcome to the Rebooting Show. I am Brian Morrissey. I am very pleased to be joined by Christian Mücke. Christian is the founder of Possible.

6
00:01:05.080 --> 00:01:17.800
If you do not know Possible, it is in its fourth year. It's the fourth edition this year. It has become one of the sort of tent pole events in the marketing media landscape.

7
00:01:17.840 --> 00:01:25.000
I mean, for me, I would, I would put them as like CS kicks off the year. Everyone has their meetings in Vegas.

8
00:01:25.360 --> 00:01:34.640
They complain about going to Vegas, and then they go to Las Vegas, and they sequester in these suites in the Cosmopolitan, and it has its own sort of rhythms, they all do.

9
00:01:35.040 --> 00:01:46.010
Maybe they see some robots, like, on the show floor, but it's really about the meetings to kick off the year. And then I think Possible has established itself in April as a go-to event. Like, I was a little skeptical.

10
00:01:46.060 --> 00:01:57.360
We'll, we'll, we'll get into that, so I want to be honest. And then Cannes is a major event. All of these things are very different. In the fall, maybe Advertising Week. I think Advertising Week that my... I'm not sure.

11
00:01:57.920 --> 00:02:03.560
DMEXCO used to be, and we'll talk about that, like, particularly in Europe. I don't know if I'm missing any.

12
00:02:03.700 --> 00:02:14.680
But, like, let's, let's get into it, Christian, 'cause I started to know of you, I don't know if we, we knew each other in person, when you were basically the face of DMEXCO.

13
00:02:14.860 --> 00:02:25.560
Like, I thought of DMEXCO like I thought of you really. But you didn't start in this events business, right? So you, you were working in Germany, then we'll get into DMEXCO.

14
00:02:25.620 --> 00:02:38.620
But e- e- ex- explain, like, how you found yourself. Yeah. Let me summarize quickly. So yes, I started... I came to the kind of media world becoming the assistant of the German Cannes Lions representatives years ago.

15
00:02:38.700 --> 00:02:49.840
That was back in the '90s. And therefore my first Cannes Lions experience was in '94 or '95, being his assistant. And of course that was purely the creativity event and only happening at the Cannes festival.

16
00:02:50.000 --> 00:03:01.060
Nothing happened on the beaches or in, in all these hotels. Wait, this was in the '90s? Yeah, that was in the '90s. '94, '95. Okay. Yeah. And then I, I- This is before my time. Okay. So you forgive me. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

17
00:03:01.120 --> 00:03:11.790
As I said, it was different. Should I say more enjoyable? I don't know. It was different. However, so and then over the next following two, three years, I learned about this internet thing which came up, right?

18
00:03:12.080 --> 00:03:24.470
And we learned about, hey, we can run ads, these boring, big static banner ads. I was then the guy in Germany, based in Germany at this time, who sold one of the first banner ads in, in, in the German market.

19
00:03:25.140 --> 00:03:36.660
So I, I run my, run my own little company, you know, kind of agency who were stepping, and I was stepping into this online digital advertising world, very early days.

20
00:03:37.440 --> 00:03:49.560
Then I came to AOL and Yahoo for a long time and worked there in, in the corp world, which was amazing. These brands were outstanding at this time. They were leading the industry.

21
00:03:49.580 --> 00:03:58.790
And then came my move when I left Yahoo in 2007. Beginning of 2007, I moved to New Zealand for private reasons, for lifestyle reasons, with my family. Right.

22
00:03:58.820 --> 00:04:11.360
And what I haven't planned then was that three months later I told my family that I'm flying back to Germany to launch a new business together with my business partner, who was based still in Germany, and that became DMEXCO.

23
00:04:11.500 --> 00:04:22.840
So we launched DMEXCO in 2008, a year later, in a time where we experienced a financial crisis, where our industry, as a kind of virtual industry, you know, we are not running hardware products.

24
00:04:22.900 --> 00:04:28.220
We are not an automotive industry, right, with hardware going into a trade fair hall. Yeah.

25
00:04:28.280 --> 00:04:39.700
So we were, I would say, the first ones who thought about a physical event, like a trade show, for this industry, which was mainly happening on screens, which was weird for many people.

26
00:04:40.280 --> 00:04:53.320
So that was my, my first step- Yeah... into the event world. And, and DMEXCO was always an outlier to me just for that reason. Like, trade shows were not really part of this world.

27
00:04:53.460 --> 00:05:03.480
A little bit with, like, Internet World and- Yeah... what was like Comde- Like, there was a few, and I think the Ad Tech Conference had an element of that.

28
00:05:03.520 --> 00:05:12.460
They had a, they had, they had a vibrant, like, sort of show floor. Well, it was added to events, you know, like CS, which for decades now is a major- But that's tech... tech show.

29
00:05:12.680 --> 00:05:23.340
Tech, tech has, tech has trade shows, and marketing did not really for the most part. But I also think there's like, tell me if I'm wrong here, there's like a little bit of a cultural element. I find, like,

30
00:05:24.300 --> 00:05:33.520
Germany in particular has a lot of trade shows. Is this, is this me, like- No, no, you... I think you're right... stereotyping or something? No, it's... I think you're right.

31
00:05:33.660 --> 00:05:44.500
So you, you can find a proper trade fairground, you know- Yeah... in every bigger city in Germany, and not just in the main capital. However, that made it our life a bit easier. You're right. That so the, the,

32
00:05:45.480 --> 00:05:57.099
the, the willingness, you know, to, to think about such a thing was, was very much there, and therefore we had to put it into a format which works well, right? With the conference added and, and things like this.

33
00:05:57.380 --> 00:06:06.300
But at the end, yes, going into a windowless big trade hall or over the time into many trade halls, right? It became- Yeah...

34
00:06:06.370 --> 00:06:17.208
a 1.5 million square feet event over the time.That was a bit weird for many people still, but the Germans are in a network where we started with, they were comfortable there, right?

35
00:06:17.228 --> 00:06:26.268
Because they, they're used to go to trade shows. Yeah, I think you're right. Yeah. So this was... When you, when you guys started it, it was more German than international. Yeah, yeah. Yeah.

36
00:06:26.308 --> 00:06:40.728
It was definitely designed in the first step for a German market, and then because we were somehow the first of its kind, you know, then we immediately felt an, an interest from European, other European regions, specifically the main markets like France, and UK, and, and Spain, et cetera.

37
00:06:41.468 --> 00:06:53.477
And then it was myself who was very much interested in bringing more gr- the global audience to, to DMEXCO at this time. So I was- Yeah... very passionate about this.

38
00:06:53.508 --> 00:07:06.208
I believe that only with an international audience, whether on stages, but on the show floor as well, with a lot of international exhibitors, it becomes a weird show because Europe was not leading that industry at this time.

39
00:07:06.328 --> 00:07:19.428
It was US and it was other regions. So I was convinced that this needs to be done to become the major event at this time for the industry. And I spent a lot of time therefore in U- in the US and also in Asia- Yeah...

40
00:07:19.468 --> 00:07:30.658
to bring more international audience to, to DMEXCO. Yeah. And, and like, Germany's like a kind of funny market I found, like, with that, in that, like, it's... Well, it's, like, big enough. I mean, I'm gonna- Yeah...

41
00:07:30.688 --> 00:07:39.588
I'm gonna be a little American here, right? Like, so it's like, it's big enough that, like, it throws its weight around that other European countries don't.

42
00:07:39.648 --> 00:07:53.368
But in the global context, like, you know, but that's why people like international. It's like, okay, well, you know, the US market is far bigger. You have to go Pan European to make Europe close to, like, the US.

43
00:07:53.928 --> 00:08:05.688
But I've, I always found the, the German market can be honestly somewhat, like, insular. Very protective. Yes. Yeah. Very protective, especially the media, media companies, et cetera, which is still the case.

44
00:08:06.368 --> 00:08:13.328
But it was, it was a m- we had massive discussions at this time, you know, why we should become, why we want to become so international, et cetera.

45
00:08:13.358 --> 00:08:19.858
And I said, "Well, you know, we, we have to bring everybody who will, who rules the world, you know. We have to be part of DMEXCO.

46
00:08:19.927 --> 00:08:31.588
We cannot believe, you know, as an isolated region here that we, we can do it on our own." So but yeah, you're right. Germany is, is very much protective when it comes to this. I also have to say that, you know,

47
00:08:32.588 --> 00:08:41.288
because I, I experienced this several times, one thing which is not true is that Europe is one country. So coming from the US- Interesting...

48
00:08:41.298 --> 00:08:47.048
especially the ad tech companies at this time, you know, who all expanded into Europe- Oh, they th- they think it's one country? [laughs] Yeah.

49
00:08:47.228 --> 00:08:52.178
So- sometimes I get, got the impression that, you know, you guys believe that this is one country and we can do it, you know- No...

50
00:08:52.268 --> 00:09:05.828
as one, one- [laughs] I can't s- I can't speak for the other 300 and something million- However, yeah, it turned out that it's not, and it turned out that the Germans had to learn that, you know, we have to open up a bit more to other regions, and, and that was the success, I think, of DMEXCO.

51
00:09:06.608 --> 00:09:18.108
Yeah. So one of the things that I rem- I never actually got to DMEXCO, only because, like, it was, it was only two days- Mm... and it was like- Yeah... it was, it wasn't a long time to go to Cologne.

52
00:09:18.608 --> 00:09:30.968
And, and, and we had a team when I was at Digiday in, in London, so they covered off on, on DMEXCO. But the things that I do know about it is one of the hallmarks of it were these stands, okay?

53
00:09:31.608 --> 00:09:41.708
And explain what the stands. Tell me if this is, if this is correct. [laughs] This is correct. I mean, uh, again, you, you go to, to a, let's, let's say you go to CS, right?

54
00:09:41.778 --> 00:09:49.928
And you see th- these impressive stands, you know, big and double storage, and, and all these things. You know, y- pe- companies- They're structures. They're like- Str- They're, they're structures...

55
00:09:49.988 --> 00:10:00.188
in- infrastructures and structures. Correct. And they invest a lot of money into this every year, again, because it needs to be redesigned. You know, you cannot reuse all the material every year and things like this.

56
00:10:00.888 --> 00:10:17.168
And this was such a need and such a passion for this, you know, to present the industry in a more and more professional way, and not just putting up your, your little banner, right, and have a high table, and, and, and two high chairs, and this is called your stand.

57
00:10:17.668 --> 00:10:29.847
So that was so impressive to see, and if you look into pictures from, from that time, especially around 2015, '16, '17, when we were at the high with 60,000 people. So you are the on- you was the only missing one, right?

58
00:10:29.958 --> 00:10:40.728
We had 60,000 people on site- [laughs]... over two days coming from all over the world, despite the, the, the, the, the bad connections, you know, to fly into Frankfurt and then hop on a train to, to Cologne.

59
00:10:40.828 --> 00:10:54.468
[laughs] But maybe that was the, the interesting part for many. Yeah. And so, so you, you left DMEXCO in, in 2019? 18. 18, yeah. 2018. Mm-hmm. Right? And I mean, I was surprised at the time.

60
00:10:54.508 --> 00:11:02.508
I don't want to get into so much detail. You probably don't want to, but, like, I had always thought that you were, like, the, the owner of it, honestly. Like, I didn't know...

61
00:11:02.768 --> 00:11:12.068
I didn't, like, deeply, you know, study DMEXCO or, but I just knew- No, we, we- You and your partner Frank, I just knew that- Yeah... you guys as, like- We had our shares.

62
00:11:12.148 --> 00:11:17.568
I mean, we, we, we were part owner, and we had our shares. And- You had control... then there was... I mean, it's such a long time ago.

63
00:11:17.608 --> 00:11:29.778
However, you know, we had a clear vision, you know, for internationalization and all these things, and there was, there was a s- a strong ask, you know, to, to focus a bit more onto the German market at this time and things like this.

64
00:11:29.857 --> 00:11:41.418
So at the end we've decided, hey, it makes sense after 11 years to go different, different paths and, and, you know, in '18, I mean, nobody knew what, what, what, what would happen shortly after. Some called me- Sure...

65
00:11:41.448 --> 00:11:49.548
you know, I was just lucky, you know, to step out of the event business before the pandemic hit us couple months later. So whatever it is, that was a great time.

66
00:11:49.588 --> 00:12:03.208
Of course, it was an exceptional time, and we made it, you know... We, we created DMEXCO, and it was seen as the international tent pole event for the digital advertising industry at this time. Okay.

67
00:12:03.328 --> 00:12:16.248
So but afterwards you were... I'm sure a lot of people are like, "You're just gonna start DMEXCO again," but you're doing something different. But what did you take from DMEXCO that led to Possible, and how- Yeah...

68
00:12:16.288 --> 00:12:18.868
what, what, what was the thing that you saw missing? Because- Yeah...

69
00:12:18.878 --> 00:12:27.660
as you said, you didn'tYou wouldn't start off in, in the events business, but then you had, like, a decade of, of experience ru- running and scaling this massive event.

70
00:12:28.300 --> 00:12:39.940
But we all take away different things, and, like, Possible is, despite me not going to New Mexico, I believe it is not a carbon copy of New Mexico. No, it's not. It's not. And a, a couple of things.

71
00:12:40.120 --> 00:12:48.360
First and foremost, if you launch-- if you think about ah launching a new business, in this case launching a new event, you have to be different than existing events.

72
00:12:48.520 --> 00:12:59.340
Of course, you cannot just expect, you know, copy and pasting something would, would, would succeed. This was one clear thing for me. You know, I, I had to think about something different.

73
00:13:00.100 --> 00:13:11.039
At the same time, it was obvious for me that the time of creating just big events, mass events, is over, at... E-especially when you think about launching a new event.

74
00:13:11.160 --> 00:13:19.100
If you're an existing, you know, event like CES, you know, or Cannes Lions, you know, you exist for decades, you have a, a lot of history, et cetera, that's a different story.

75
00:13:19.180 --> 00:13:30.940
You're, you're building on that and develop further. But with, with something new in your mind, you have to be different, and it was not just about becoming big. I think quantity is no longer a currency.

76
00:13:31.440 --> 00:13:43.600
It's all about quality, and everybody agrees with this I've spoken to. Whether the, the brands, whether executives, whether tech companies, time and efforts to spend is more valuable than any kind of budget.

77
00:13:43.900 --> 00:13:53.880
So approaching this idea of Possible was not- Yeah... how can I make it commercially successful? How can I make it big to sell it five years later? That would be the wrong approach.

78
00:13:54.240 --> 00:14:06.090
It was purely all about quality, and convince the entire marketing world how it's set up in today's world, which is far more diverse and complex, as we know. To bring- Yeah...

79
00:14:06.120 --> 00:14:12.830
everybody together in a so highly creative way, and I'm not just talking about the stages and the programming.

80
00:14:13.620 --> 00:14:25.460
In many ways, highly curated that people see this as a huge benefit, as an added value to all the existing events in our industry. Because one was... One, one more thing. One was obvious for me.

81
00:14:25.540 --> 00:14:33.040
We are going for not increasing budgets when it comes to the commercial part. We had to go to the existing budgets.

82
00:14:33.120 --> 00:14:45.880
So we had to be so successful that companies and people will take money away from other events to, to put into- to spend with us. Okay. And your, the sponsor base, right?

83
00:14:45.980 --> 00:14:57.440
Like, I mean, you're- you've got attendee, you know, revenue, but you also have sponsor revenue. Yeah. And sponsor revenue is usually, I don't know how it is in your model, but it's usually larger in, in these models.

84
00:14:58.040 --> 00:15:08.309
And m- a lot of the sponsor, and honestly, the attendees, I mean, it... They- these are substitutable in some way. Like, I mean, you do have to make budget decisions. Mm-hmm.

85
00:15:08.360 --> 00:15:18.500
You know, and like, you know, you put it on the calendar when you did, and I think it was probably strategic between CES and Cannes. Like, you're not... You know, there was ta- there was talk for a while.

86
00:15:18.540 --> 00:15:27.350
I think Martin Sorrell really kicked it off by saying Cannes was too brash and stuff one year, and just because it was too, too expensive. Yeah. And it is expensive, trust me.

87
00:15:27.350 --> 00:15:41.720
So- And Martin also told me wh- when I, when I, when I was sharing my idea, my vision before I launched Possible with some of the leaders in the market, and Martin, of course, was one of them, of course, we are close friends, and he immediately told me, "Christian, we don't need another fucking event, so don't do this."

88
00:15:42.240 --> 00:15:52.120
[laughs] Okay, so this was not the event he wanted. I think he does one in Cannes somewhere, like, a little bit less expensive than the south of France, and there's a lot of difficulties in operating in Cannes.

89
00:15:52.160 --> 00:16:01.790
Like, it's just... It's, it's a very difficult place. I'm surprised that Essential hasn't, hasn't threatened, if they haven't already, to move it somewhere else. But you, you didn't wanna go head-to-head with that.

90
00:16:01.940 --> 00:16:12.980
Cannes is a, Cannes is a juggernaut. I mean, it's massive. The opportunity you saw was, one, to do a marketing conference, but also situated in close to the United States, in Miami. Yeah.

91
00:16:13.060 --> 00:16:22.020
And that-- And I think that, that's important. Like, you know, getting... Cannes is a, is a global event, right? But there's a lot of Americans who go there.

92
00:16:22.060 --> 00:16:33.279
Tell me what else that yous- you decided was, you know, the white space- Yeah... because you didn't want it to ma- you don't build a... Cannes was built in a totally different generation. Mm-hmm.

93
00:16:33.360 --> 00:16:37.330
A- and so it was started by French cinema owners, for anyone who doesn't know- Right...

94
00:16:37.340 --> 00:16:46.420
the long tortured history, because they started putting ads on movie screens, and so they said, "Hey, we gotta get excitement around this. We gotta get better ads, so let's start- Right... like, a- an awards program."

95
00:16:46.460 --> 00:16:55.300
And it grew out of that. But you decided to do something that was a little bit more, I think it's more, it's more business-focused. Cannes is this way, but, like, it's a weird...

96
00:16:55.760 --> 00:17:04.380
Because of its history, it's, it's a weird, like, amalgamation of things, I think. And also, like, the ecosystem of that, which I think is important. Yeah. It's...

97
00:17:04.420 --> 00:17:16.740
You, you cannot compare us because of the reasons you've mentioned, and, and at some stage, you know, you, you need different events around the year for, for most of the companies who were then targeting different audiences.

98
00:17:17.360 --> 00:17:24.760
But everybody is more, more thoughtful about where to spend time and money with less events. That's my impression from the last couple of years.

99
00:17:25.450 --> 00:17:30.160
So if you're in the range of the top three events, then you're the winner, otherwise you, you struggle.

100
00:17:30.220 --> 00:17:36.980
And it was obvious for me that with the experience from New Mexico, I bel- I still believe in the, in the activation space.

101
00:17:37.080 --> 00:17:47.420
I don't call it trade fair show anymore because I, I wanted something which provides more excitement and more inspiration, and therefore I decided to go to Miami Beach in the US. This is the market.

102
00:17:48.140 --> 00:17:56.640
There was a need for that. It doesn't exist. It didn't exist at this time. And Miami, obviously, is... It, it was for, for all the attendees and partners, it was a...

103
00:17:56.700 --> 00:18:03.580
I mean, we all Miami for different reasons, but for the event business, it was the first time going to Miami for such an event. And otherwise, we know Vegas.

104
00:18:03.660 --> 00:18:14.250
You know, everybody goes to Vegas 10 times a year for all kind of events, or New York. However, that allows- allowed me to do something differently, indoor/outdoor activations- Yeah... in combination with a conference.

105
00:18:14.640 --> 00:18:24.960
And this sounds simple, but it didn't exist, and this makes it so unique at this highly curated level I've already mentioned. I'll come back to this later on.And then talking to brands and marketeers.

106
00:18:25.480 --> 00:18:39.640
That Possible idea was designed and discussed with marketeers from marketeers foremost, and therefore the MMA as the association of the industry body for marketeers was heavily involved and, and was, was a key driver as well.

107
00:18:39.700 --> 00:18:55.200
So with this support, and then a lot of industry leaders who just believed into the vision and, and joined me to, to bring it to life, that was such an impressive support, and honestly, I would only do it again in the US because of this- Yeah...

108
00:18:55.220 --> 00:19:06.030
environment which is positive for entrepreneurs. You cannot do this in, in Germany. You cannot do this in Europe like this. Yeah. A- I think that, that's right. Like, so at the... I- it's in the Fontainebleau, at...

109
00:19:06.100 --> 00:19:12.560
which Miamians call the Fountainbleau for some unknown reason. I will call it the Fontainebleau. It's in the Fontainebleau in Miami Beach.

110
00:19:12.760 --> 00:19:23.720
And the outdoor area i-i-it, which is usually a series of pools, it still is a series of pools, but it's surrounded by a lot of these cabanas that, that sponsors take out. They have meetings there.

111
00:19:24.170 --> 00:19:31.440
They have some, like, cocktail hours and, and whatnot, and they're just, like, they're little- Presentations and yeah... I guess I didn't see this beforehand.

112
00:19:31.460 --> 00:19:38.600
But now this year we're expanding into the Eden Roc and Nobu Hotel next door, so we are, we are- Yeah. Yeah... doubling the footprint. It's still one central place, which is great.

113
00:19:38.640 --> 00:19:43.020
You don't need to hop in a cab, you know, or a taxi to go to s- to, to another place.

114
00:19:43.130 --> 00:19:50.920
And we bring around 6,000 people, you know, senior executives from brands, from agencies, consultancies, tech companies, creative economy together.

115
00:19:51.740 --> 00:20:05.240
And this, this environment provides such an energy, but in a positive way. It's not chaotic, it's not too overwhelming. It's created. It's somehow better structured. This year we also go into the beach- Yeah...

116
00:20:05.260 --> 00:20:16.780
with th- running... We are running 3,000 meetings, scheduled meetings between brand marketeers and vendors. In addition to your own schedule you are setting up when you're one of our partners and have your own space.

117
00:20:17.220 --> 00:20:23.440
This is optional. Okay. Are you doing, are you doing that on the beach? We're doing this on the beach, so it, it, it, it- I see. You could do this kind of thing in Miami... could be a better environment.

118
00:20:24.180 --> 00:20:31.880
This is the kind of thing you don't do in New York. Like, you could do this, and not just because there is no beach- Exactly... but, like, Miami would be like, "You want the beach for a day? Absolutely." Exactly.

119
00:20:31.940 --> 00:20:41.210
Things happen there. They love business. They love capitalism. Yeah. Yeah. So yeah, you bring up a really interesting point, and that is the hosted buyer model, right? Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

120
00:20:41.220 --> 00:20:52.040
And so we're gonna get a little event nerdy here. Yeah. There's different types of events. You know, it's not just events. Like, we talked about trade shows. Those have their own... I personally am, like...

121
00:20:52.780 --> 00:20:59.590
As, like, a consumer, I'm horrified by trade shows. But, like, as someone who is a capitalist, I really like trade shows.

122
00:20:59.840 --> 00:21:10.840
Any business where your customers line up at the end to sign their contract for the next year, I like that business. I like it a lot. [chuckles] Mm-hmm. But, like, there's, there's upsides and downsides to that.

123
00:21:10.880 --> 00:21:22.340
Hosted buyer model is one I know really well, because this was the model that was used at Digiday. Digiday. Mm-hmm. And it... And basically it, it involves you...

124
00:21:22.980 --> 00:21:34.080
It's almost like a controlled circ model of, of trade publishing, but you bring in, like, a lot of the sort of target audience, I don't know how else to put it, and, you know, they're your guests, you know.

125
00:21:34.090 --> 00:21:45.760
They might get a travel stipend. They get a, a free... a comp ticket to the event. Yeah. Yeah. And in exchange they, they do, they do meetings with your ecosystem partners, which are the people who wa- wanna sell to you.

126
00:21:45.900 --> 00:21:51.230
Now, that sounds, like, pretty... You know, to some, like in the capital J journalism world, they're like, "That's a little crass." Mm.

127
00:21:51.240 --> 00:22:03.760
Like, this is a, this is a business, and matching up a buy and a sell side is how business takes place. So talk to me about how you decided to meld a few different models with Possible, 'cause I don't think it's...

128
00:22:04.320 --> 00:22:13.320
There's a festival model, there's a conference model- Mm-hmm... there's a hosted buyer model, and it seems like you've taken, like, a few different elements. Absolutely correct.

129
00:22:13.420 --> 00:22:24.420
I like the description as you, as you said. It was the... The challenge was to combine it in a, in a, in a good way that it doesn't feel separated, separate from, from each other.

130
00:22:25.160 --> 00:22:28.900
Obviously, we, we, we, we did this, and it became one great experience.

131
00:22:29.120 --> 00:22:42.819
And on top of that, we have so many different formats that whether you're a senior marketeer, whether you're an tech executives, whether you're from the mid-management, we, we provide different formats for each of those individuals or each of these audiences.

132
00:22:43.420 --> 00:22:54.820
And that makes it so unique that y- you can really pick and choose. And when it comes to whether you want to spend... And it's all optional, right? It's no obligation that you have to go into meetings, for example.

133
00:22:54.850 --> 00:23:04.940
It's optional. But of course, the benefit is it's targeted, as you said. You know exactly who you're going to meet. It's doubled confirmed, double opt-in. So brand marketeers who are committed to the...

134
00:23:04.960 --> 00:23:14.000
committing to the, to these meetings, or a minimum number of meetings over three days, as you said, they get a comp ticket for the entire show. They get a travel reimbursement.

135
00:23:14.100 --> 00:23:25.200
So there's no reason for a CMO, for, for a team leader to, to deny, you know, that, that the team is coming as well. And this is how we bring more marketeers on site. And, and- And that's critical...

136
00:23:25.560 --> 00:23:36.760
it's critical for most, if not all of, of the rest to be able to con- connect with them in different ways. The hosted meeting program- Yeah, because in this world... Yeah, in this world the, like, marketer is...

137
00:23:36.800 --> 00:23:44.200
Like, I always joke that, like, all you need to know about this world is that there are multiple marketer halls of fame. You know?

138
00:23:44.240 --> 00:23:51.750
The fact that there d- isn't just one, that there's [chuckles] multiple ones, tells you the money starts on the marketer side, okay? Yeah. Absolutely.

139
00:23:51.750 --> 00:24:03.550
And it wa- makes its way through a crazy daisy chain ecosystem, and some of it ends up in publishers, [chuckles] a lot of it does not. Yeah. But, like, that, that's how it works, and there's a lot...

140
00:24:03.610 --> 00:24:13.290
And the marketers are the kind of rock stars. And in an ecosystem event, which means you're not just... It's not the A- it's not the ANA, right? Like, you...

141
00:24:13.600 --> 00:24:21.380
But you need to have at your core the marketer audience, right? Even if they're gonna be a minority of the attendees, right? Mm-hmm. Absolutely.

142
00:24:21.840 --> 00:24:31.652
And we, we call it at, at Hive Group, you know, who, who acquired us two years ago-We call them the gold dust. You know, Mark Joshua, our CEO, calls them the gold dust, and this is exactly the right description.

143
00:24:31.732 --> 00:24:40.492
You know, these are the most, well, valuable, but of course, th-they are, they are so hesitant, you know, to go to events, for good reasons.

144
00:24:40.572 --> 00:24:55.972
They, they prefer peer-to-peer conversations because the challenges which are-they are facing are so, so immense, and this is the reason why we came up all over the last three years with additional ideas how to serve the marketing industry and the marketeers themselves.

145
00:24:56.392 --> 00:25:09.032
We have a new CMO experience this year with the CMO lab, which is not a typical conference type of thing, which allows marketeers, senior marketeers to come together in a protected environment for peer-to-peer conversations over three days.

146
00:25:09.372 --> 00:25:16.072
Because they normally don't want to be in a big room with a thousand sellers in the room, right? This is, this is not their style, which I totally understand.

147
00:25:16.132 --> 00:25:24.112
On the other hand, they're happy to send their teams into the meetings, right, and, and to, to bring all the information back into the company. So you keep, you keep the...

148
00:25:24.192 --> 00:25:34.892
I think someone has-had mentioned it to me at one, like, possible, about, like, the CMOs being in, like, the red keep. You know, like, [laughs] they're like, they're, like, sort of like not actually there.

149
00:25:34.932 --> 00:25:46.652
We were saying the market- like, they're there, but like, you know, it's, it's almost like- No, they're there and, and with these things, you know, we keep them on site and, and, you know, and not just having them on stage speaking and then disappear.

150
00:25:46.752 --> 00:25:55.412
This is one big benefit. And of course, there are so many events happening, as you've mentioned at the beginning, you know, happy hours on site and then of course a dinner here and lunch here.

151
00:25:55.472 --> 00:26:07.192
So they are all involved in this. But of course- Yeah... you cannot expect a, a global CMO from one of the top 10 advertisers walking around the show floor or the, the activation space all day long, right?

152
00:26:07.312 --> 00:26:14.472
This is not going to happen. As well as, you know, Elon Musk. When we had Elon Musk there in the first year, of course, he didn't do this as well.

153
00:26:14.632 --> 00:26:20.432
So this is something which just requires a more creative approach to connect the right people together.

154
00:26:21.092 --> 00:26:34.931
And there is always, you know, there's always part of the audience which fits perfectly well, you know, just browsing around all day long and run into each other, while others would like to have a scheduled itinerary before they, before they show up.

155
00:26:34.991 --> 00:26:50.312
I think that's, that's fair and absolutely normal. Yeah. And I think choosing the Fontainebleau was, was, was a good decision because, like, it's unusual for a Miami Beach property in that it is, it's, it's very large.

156
00:26:50.632 --> 00:27:06.772
Like, it almost seems like, it almost reminds me of a little bit of, like, a Las Vegas kind of s- in that, like, most, like, Miami Beach hotels are, are not as large as the Fontainebleau complex, and now they've built out a conference center and it connects to, to Eden Rock.

157
00:27:07.002 --> 00:27:18.452
And really you can... I don't know how you end up seeing it because, uh, I think it was last year I was like, "You guys gotta take over the entire Fontainebleau." We got families on vacations. We got OnlyFans models.

158
00:27:18.792 --> 00:27:27.682
Like, I, I feel bad. I always feel bad. Like, I'm like knowing that it's Miami and they always forget to tell pe-tourists that the tip is included in the bill. Mm-hmm.

159
00:27:27.752 --> 00:27:35.632
That, like, they don't tell the people who are booking that, like, you're gonna be in the middle of a massive mar- not massive- Yeah... but for them it'll be massive- Yeah... massive marketing conference. Yeah.

160
00:27:36.302 --> 00:27:36.952
No, it was...

161
00:27:37.032 --> 00:27:49.712
I remember I went to Miami Beach in '22, March '22, and signed the contract with the Fontainebleau at the end of the pandemic, and it was just a year before the first event should, should, should be launched.

162
00:27:49.752 --> 00:28:01.222
So it was a tough timeline. And I arrived there in March, and it was spring break. As you can imagine, arriving there, I, I was, I was shocked, right, seeing, uh, seeing the- Oh, that was, there's gonna be a...

163
00:28:01.252 --> 00:28:08.632
That was the original spring break too. This is, this was, like, a little wilder. Miami Beach has cracked down on spring break since. Well, it was wild enough for me, right?

164
00:28:08.672 --> 00:28:14.022
And I thought to myself, "Holy, holy moly, how should I do an event here-" It's more PG 13 now, Christian... during these times?"

165
00:28:14.052 --> 00:28:27.892
So but we figured out at the end, we are in April when spring break is over, and of course we are, we are really, really ambitious that, you know, we wanted to have a buyout, a complete buyout, so that we can really keep our audience together.

166
00:28:27.922 --> 00:28:33.592
And this is the case now. So it's a full buyout of the Fontainebleau. Oh, great. A full buyout of the Eden Rock. Next door we have Soho House.

167
00:28:34.152 --> 00:28:42.472
And yes, it was somehow part of the vision, you know, when I thought about how to further grow. Yeah. Well, I think one of the... And tell me if, if, if I'm wrong here.

168
00:28:42.512 --> 00:28:56.222
It's like, one of the weird parts about Cannes is that they leak a lot, you know? I mean, the, the reality is, like, you go to Cannes and there's activations everywhere. Yeah.

169
00:28:56.222 --> 00:29:07.632
Outside of the Palais is where the main sort of programming takes place, but it's so decentralized everywhere in Cannes. People have beaches. People have houses. People have villas. Mm-hmm.

170
00:29:08.092 --> 00:29:17.732
Up and down the Croisette, the main, like, drag. Whereas i- when you're in Miami Beach, you're, first of all, you're not in South Beach, which is good. Right.

171
00:29:18.032 --> 00:29:27.112
And then you're kind of, it's, it's mid beach and you're kind of, like, contained a little bit. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But you're not, like, isolated where you're a- at some, like...

172
00:29:27.492 --> 00:29:31.632
You know, a lot of people do events in, like- Yeah. We, we did one once at SCAD. You're in a card, you're in a card in prison.

173
00:29:31.812 --> 00:29:43.412
You, of course, and therefore in the evening when all these, you know, gatherings and dinners happening, are happening and parties as well, this also happens in offsite, nearby or in, in somewhere in Miami Beach and sometimes also in Miami, which is great.

174
00:29:43.452 --> 00:29:53.442
So we create an ecosystem, a massive community around this. The event itself will grow further, but it's not about, as I said at the beginning, it's not about numbers per se, right? Yeah.

175
00:29:53.572 --> 00:30:05.112
I don't have the vision that it has to be 20,000, 30,000 in two years' time. It has to be the right quality. Bringing the right people into the room is still the main goal, and then you grow automatically.

176
00:30:05.692 --> 00:30:21.472
But knowing that a lot of more parties, you know, are, are added to, and, and not parties in terms of events, but parties in terms of companies and, and, and the entire ecosystem is now looking into Miami every April and, and is added to the event itself, which- Yeah...

177
00:30:21.512 --> 00:30:30.712
which is another kind of growth, which is great to see by, by the way. You know that this is now becomingYeah, the tentpole event, at least for the US market.

178
00:30:31.332 --> 00:30:40.792
And of course, I would not complain to have an even more international audience over the next couple of years, but let's see. Yeah. No, that, that, that makes a ton of sense.

179
00:30:40.992 --> 00:30:49.072
No, I think it's established itself there on the calendar. It's... And so you- If, if you consider to come back every year, then it's an established event. Yeah, I don't even go to [laughs] DMEXCO, right?

180
00:30:49.252 --> 00:30:56.212
I, again, it was just, it was too far. We had people who were, like, an hour away. They took... They were always like they took the train. They went to the- Right... what is that?

181
00:30:56.282 --> 00:31:07.972
That ExchangeWire Conference used to have it before DMEXCO, and then they would go to this... I don't... I, I, you know, I was just letting them take the lead. That was it. It was nothing about DMEXCO. But, like, you...

182
00:31:08.042 --> 00:31:17.852
It's also capped, right? Like, in, in... I mean, those are, like, big hotels, right? But, like, you can't do... It would be difficult to do, like, a 15,000...

183
00:31:18.052 --> 00:31:24.612
I don't think you could, like, i- in that space anyway if you wanted to. Maybe with the new conference center. I don't know.

184
00:31:24.652 --> 00:31:32.911
You'd have to move over to the- I mean, what I've learned as well is, yes, you need, you need a planning. And, and of course, you have to have a vision which you can share with your audience.

185
00:31:33.152 --> 00:31:42.452
I'm not thinking about the next six, seven, eight years, to be honest, because things are changing so dramatically. Yeah. It will evolve, and I think we are flexible enough, to be honest.

186
00:31:42.492 --> 00:31:53.932
We, we, we have, we have, you know, big convention centers in Miami Beach. We have additional convention centers in the hotels. We have other hotels next to, to those ones we're already using.

187
00:31:54.392 --> 00:32:06.322
So I- I don't know where we will really e- end up in a couple of years' time if it becomes such a big event with tens of thousands of people. Again, I'm not working for that goal every day.

188
00:32:06.532 --> 00:32:09.432
I'm just working on the qualities, right? You'll take it. You'll take it. That's okay.

189
00:32:09.442 --> 00:32:16.312
[laughs] And, and, yeah, let's, let's have this conversation in, in three, four years' time, and then we, we might say, okay, that was...

190
00:32:16.372 --> 00:32:21.472
It's still the same, and it's, it's established as the Davos of the marketing world, right?

191
00:32:21.552 --> 00:32:33.532
Because Davos, the World Economy Forum, it's not the biggest event in the world, but it's seen as the most important one when it comes to a different agenda, as we all know. So it's not necessarily the biggest one. Yeah.

192
00:32:33.612 --> 00:32:45.692
Right. And so a lot of publishers are, are pivoting to events. Mm-hmm. Right? And I've always been struck by, at least in this industry, and I don't know if it's reflective... I mean, it is in, throughout B2B.

193
00:32:45.772 --> 00:32:52.672
I mean, usually... Yeah, it's weird because in B2B media, you end up having, like, your competitive set is totally different, right?

194
00:32:52.752 --> 00:33:06.052
Because a lot of the business models are around events, and your competitors are not just other publishers. And I think, I think lots of publishers are finding this out now, not just in B2B. It's trade associations.

195
00:33:06.112 --> 00:33:17.081
They, they ha- often have, like, the biggest event in a sector. It's independent. It's, you know, events organizations like Possible is not a... It, it's not like a publisher, right? Mm-hmm.

196
00:33:17.092 --> 00:33:26.801
I mean, you publish content, but it, but it's not at its r- heart a publisher. And I think that there's upsides and downsides to, to both approaches.

197
00:33:26.832 --> 00:33:37.152
What would you say are the dynamics that a lot of publishers get wrong when they do events versus, like, when people who are not publishers, who are not, you know, content...

198
00:33:37.852 --> 00:33:40.452
I don't wanna say content-focused, but like- Mm... you know what I mean.

199
00:33:40.492 --> 00:33:52.692
Like, publishers, like, media, how media approaches events, I find, particularly if they're, they come from the journalistic side, it is often very different from how business people pr- Yeah... events.

200
00:33:52.752 --> 00:34:05.292
Because you have live journalism on one side, and then you have people who understand that this is about matching up a buy and a sell side, and the programming and the insights piece are a part of that.

201
00:34:05.912 --> 00:34:11.552
But they, uh, but that is next to, like, cocktail parties. I would always say this to, like, RTO.

202
00:34:11.592 --> 00:34:17.772
I'm like, "The stuff we do on stage is unbelievably important, but don't get this twisted, the cocktail party is just as important."

203
00:34:18.512 --> 00:34:27.952
I mean, that's, that's a very good question, and I, I also would like to in- in- include associations in my, in my feedback to you. Yeah. Publishers and media companies and associations.

204
00:34:28.072 --> 00:34:36.732
I understand that if you have, if you build up such an audience, right? As an association, you have your members. Publisher, you have your audience, your readers and so on.

205
00:34:37.412 --> 00:34:48.132
You want to stay connected with them all year round. And it's, it's obvious that you want to have this also, let's call it monetized, commercialized, connected to them all year round at events.

206
00:34:48.212 --> 00:35:01.062
Yeah, the margins on events are really good. Not too bad. But then you are s- stuck in the middle of the big events, independent events, and those ones who are, I call them boutique events, right?

207
00:35:01.112 --> 00:35:10.252
The 50, 100, 150 people events wh- where the more senior people are, you know, like to be more because of the peer-to-peer conversations, intimate environments.

208
00:35:10.992 --> 00:35:19.501
And this makes it very difficult per se to have an event over one, two, three days with a couple of hundred people at least, if not into the thousands.

209
00:35:20.492 --> 00:35:30.672
A- and then you're, you're also stuck in to, to your audience, right? And, and- Mm-hmm... the, the external perspectives are somehow missing, you know. And this is what I had in mind with Possible.

210
00:35:30.732 --> 00:35:42.592
Embracing the entire economy, embracing the entire marketing world, and not exclude anyone. And I, I was also approached and, and was asked, "Hey, are you, are you, now competing with publisher events or...

211
00:35:42.822 --> 00:35:54.962
" I said, "Absolutely not," because this is an addition, but this is the first of its kind which embrace everybody and everything. And, and I think this is the challenge, and I've seen a couple of failing, right?

212
00:35:55.072 --> 00:36:05.292
I mean, some of these events disappeared in the meantime from publishers and from associations because you need, you need a dedicated knowledge to run events.

213
00:36:05.352 --> 00:36:16.672
It's not just that you can say, "Hey, we are great in creating content," and you can bring content on stage, no doubt, as a publisher. You can bring great content on stage and great speakers because of your network.

214
00:36:16.712 --> 00:36:19.952
But what's beyond that? You have content, and you have...

215
00:36:20.152 --> 00:36:30.312
You create some networking opportunities, but I think people wants also business opportunities, and this is what an event like Possible and others will do, and this goes beyond that.

216
00:36:30.992 --> 00:36:43.972
I've seen too manySimilar events providing content more or less isolated, you know, focusing on one dedicated topic or, or audience, this is not enough in today's world anymore. This is not enough.

217
00:36:44.032 --> 00:37:00.392
And by the way, sorry to say, as a non-American coming to the US and be then invited to those events, in the middle of nowhere for one and a half or two days in a resort disconnected from the rest of the world, if it's not a senior leadership summit, then I don't want that.

218
00:37:00.472 --> 00:37:11.892
You know? I'm ending up in a, in a windowless kind of, uh, a ballroom, ballroom of one of these hotels which look all similar, and, and you see- Do not invite Chris into Scottsdale, to your event in Scottsdale.

219
00:37:11.952 --> 00:37:19.221
He's not interested. This... No, this is not- Very- This is not in- this is, this is not inspiring. I, I don't, I don't see huge benefits out of this, to be honest with you.

220
00:37:19.232 --> 00:37:21.932
Well, that is the irony that's like, you know, look, I spent...

221
00:37:22.032 --> 00:37:36.642
I have, like, a lot of strong opinions about resorts because I spent 10 years where I added it up, I would spend basically 30 days a year in resorts, so I have a lot of strong opinions about turn-down service and various other resort matters.

222
00:37:36.652 --> 00:37:47.952
But it was always you're in the most beautiful place, and you're in a, a, a, a windowless, dark, like, uh, hotel ballroom with the same horrible carpets and the chandeliers. Exactly.

223
00:37:48.012 --> 00:37:57.872
I was looking at those chandeliers for almost a decade, so- Exactly... I, I, I hear you. And that is, like, something that I think, you know, like, events are a... They're difficult to do.

224
00:37:57.932 --> 00:38:06.922
They're a details business, [lip smack] and it's not just you roll the ball out and then, like, say, "Hey, we're doing some live journalism. There's cocktails at 5:00." Yeah.

225
00:38:06.992 --> 00:38:13.112
You have to get all the details right, and you are... You have a job to do, and that is matching up people with each other.

226
00:38:13.312 --> 00:38:25.932
People go to events to connect not just with new ideas, that is the absolute part of it, but they, they generally judge the success of the event on who they connected with. At least that's how I do. Yeah.

227
00:38:26.012 --> 00:38:36.832
I went to, I went to a cocktail party last night, and I... The hors d'oeuvres were fine. There was a little bit of, like, quote unquote, "programming" in a discussion, but it was mostly about the people I talked to.

228
00:38:37.172 --> 00:38:46.452
Yeah. So. And there's another aspect wh- what, what I believe is, is m- becoming more important, is also knowing it from my own experience, having...

229
00:38:46.492 --> 00:38:53.632
You know, I, I've seen, I think, all our industry events around the world, uh, in, in, in recent years. Quite often, you're... you come to an event and then you're...

230
00:38:53.672 --> 00:39:04.152
It's your own responsibility to get organized and, and, you know, to get orientation, et cetera. And if the b- the e- event is even bigger, then, of course, you, you...

231
00:39:04.172 --> 00:39:11.132
sometimes you f- you feel really lost and too overwhelmed. People want, want to be hosted.

232
00:39:11.332 --> 00:39:26.912
You need to be a host, which means my philosophy is also if we go into the thousands now coming to Possible every year, at the end, I would like to know everybody's agenda and expectation and, and wishlist to meet their requirements, to meet their expectations.

233
00:39:27.552 --> 00:39:32.191
And this, I, I want to describe with, with that example that you, you...

234
00:39:32.352 --> 00:39:43.032
it's not enough to just call people into a place and then leave it with them to get organized and find their own way, to find the right content, power, and find the right people to connect with, et cetera.

235
00:39:43.912 --> 00:39:52.132
I think in a very meaningful way, they want to be hosted, they want to be curated, and this is what I've meant at the beginning. This is what we try to achieve with Possible.

236
00:39:52.162 --> 00:40:04.552
It's not just bringing thousands together and then, "Yeah, find your own way." We are spending so much efforts and time and, and, and money, by the way, to, to make this a different experience. Yeah.

237
00:40:04.612 --> 00:40:12.912
I mean, there's a drone show, at least there was. Not this year. [laughs] No? Okay. There's still time, may- there, there could be, there could be someone that comes in late.

238
00:40:13.572 --> 00:40:23.602
What do you think of the, like, festival approach to, to events compared to how, how you're doing things? I wouldn't call Possible a festival, but you- Right. I don't think of it as- No, no- Yeah...

239
00:40:23.612 --> 00:40:30.932
but you said, you know, it was a festival component, it was a conference component, and a meeting component, et cetera. I think this, this is a, uh, the right combination.

240
00:40:31.012 --> 00:40:36.632
Festival is people wants to be more entertained, inspired, wants to have in...

241
00:40:36.832 --> 00:40:47.031
be, be more in a creative environment, call it whatever it is, but not entertained in a way that it's, it's only fun and, and, you know, just, just for, for pleasure. Of course it's business. We talk about business.

242
00:40:47.612 --> 00:40:59.252
But you do business, you're more creative, you're more inspired, you're more open-minded, I believe, if you're in such an environment and with people. And by the way, this is why we also came up with the name Possible.

243
00:40:59.372 --> 00:41:00.892
Be in such a positive environment.

244
00:41:01.492 --> 00:41:13.742
You know, we have a lot of challenges to overcome and to, to solve and, and problems and things like this and as an industry, and the environment is, as we all know, becoming more difficult or every year it feels like this.

245
00:41:14.432 --> 00:41:21.252
Let's create a positive momentum with Possible. Let's make everything possible. Let's make the impossible possible.

246
00:41:21.262 --> 00:41:36.432
Let's create this momentum and environment to inspire people so that the outcome is more, is, is more exciting, it's, it's, it's, it's more specific, concrete, whatever you call it, for everybody to take home.

247
00:41:36.892 --> 00:41:48.092
And if we can achieve this, then I, I'm, I'm doing a good job with my team. Yeah. How do you... And, and I guess it's on their side, but you end up having to do it as, as a seller.

248
00:41:48.172 --> 00:41:54.312
Like, how do you f- how do you show ROI on, on what... on the sponsorships, right? Like, so the...

249
00:41:54.372 --> 00:42:05.412
I think one of the things that I always liked about a hosted buyer model is that, that part of the model, and a lot of that was the Digiday model that I'm very familiar with- Yeah... was that it produced receipts.

250
00:42:05.972 --> 00:42:15.292
I was like, "Okay, you had these meetings with th- this, these people, had this much, you know, spending power, and, you know, we did our job."

251
00:42:15.732 --> 00:42:27.632
You know, before we had that model when I was there, it was like, "Okay, let's hope that the sales team did their job at the cocktail party and connected with the people that they needed to."

252
00:42:27.692 --> 00:42:37.042
Whereas this allowed it to be very, like, curated, but also produce, like, receipts. But, like, how do you end up thinking about that? 'Cause I think as, like, as events become- Mm...

253
00:42:37.372 --> 00:42:46.192
so much more important, I know that there's startups, like, working on this. Yeah. The attribution, it, it needs to get far better. Yeah. I mean, this is a, this is a big business. Yeah.

254
00:42:46.292 --> 00:42:52.160
And I also believe that because of s- requirements are far, far more diverse than everYou need different layers.

255
00:42:52.380 --> 00:43:02.140
So first and foremost, which is the core, core thing behind everything, is you bring, in this case, a couple of thousand people together. What is your audience? Who is your audience?

256
00:43:02.700 --> 00:43:10.780
Is it just everybody who belongs to this? Is it, it doesn't matter the seniority level? And, and you have to think about your audience. This is the base for everything.

257
00:43:10.820 --> 00:43:26.120
Those 6,000 or, you know, 6,000 plus executives on site in April, they're all providing such a benefit for our partners who will show up in different ways. So, and then you need different layers.

258
00:43:26.160 --> 00:43:38.430
You need, you need, you need to give everybody, the partner side, but also the audience side, enough flexibility to find their own way, to find each other and, and, and have a more randomly set up agenda every day.

259
00:43:38.960 --> 00:43:46.220
For those who wants to be more specific, we set up these dedicated meetings. You know exactly who you're going to meet. You know exactly the topic you're discussing with.

260
00:43:46.260 --> 00:43:55.320
So we're creating business opportunities, very s- s- specific ones. And then we have the, the, the, the content part, you know, the conference, which provides ideas

261
00:43:56.340 --> 00:44:06.660
for your business, and therefore you are starting to think about who can be... who can help me in my today's business and in my tomorrow's business. And everybody is on site. That's the beauty.

262
00:44:06.700 --> 00:44:13.700
You don't need to leave the event and think about it, "Who can help me?" And then think about six months and reach out to, to different parties.

263
00:44:14.260 --> 00:44:25.060
You have them all on site, tech companies, agencies, consultancies, et cetera, et cetera. So you can do your job, and this is so important to understand. You can do your job.

264
00:44:25.140 --> 00:44:34.280
If you attend, it's possible you can do your job, and you should spend the full three days or three and a half days with kicking off on Sunday in the meetup. This runs your business for the next couple of months.

265
00:44:34.340 --> 00:44:42.260
You, you, you don't need... Honestly, you don't need necessary to go to another event within the next couple of weeks or months because you can really do it here.

266
00:44:42.480 --> 00:44:52.020
Do not just show up and go into a keynote session and then go to a party and then disappear, because then you're running behind. Yeah. There, these opportunities we provide all on site.

267
00:44:52.500 --> 00:45:03.360
So as someone who do- I mean, I do smaller scale gatherings. I don't do to this size or even the size that, that we had done at Digiday when I was there. I'm always amazed at the, the sheer number of events.

268
00:45:03.740 --> 00:45:12.260
Like, you must also be, right? Like, I regularly talk with people who are like... I'm like, "I can't believe," I go on LinkedIn, and I'm like, "There are...

269
00:45:12.280 --> 00:45:17.060
There are some people that I think might be at events, like, 250 days a year." Mm-hmm.

270
00:45:17.140 --> 00:45:26.480
I don't know if other industries operate this way other than the sort of media marketing- I think we're very special as an industry, yes, when it comes to this. [laughs] You sound like a valiant. [laughs] Yes.

271
00:45:26.540 --> 00:45:35.700
I'm gonna, I'm gonna use that euphemism going forward, Christian. Yeah. At least I'll use it as a euphemism. Like, what, what, what do you see... Yeah, what do you see as, as...

272
00:45:36.220 --> 00:45:43.329
Do you see that there's too many events, and, like, what... And, and, and what do you think will end up- No, I'm not saying that- Yeah, good one...

273
00:45:43.329 --> 00:45:52.510
I'm not saying there are too many events because they're all there for a reason, but I'm saying that I, I see people going to less events a year. Okay. So they're spending less time at events. I understand that.

274
00:45:52.540 --> 00:46:01.070
And this, of course, brings some, or will, will create some potential issues for some events, you know, who are not in this critical spotlight.

275
00:46:01.700 --> 00:46:10.600
In general, you know, everybody belongs to the industry, so if you're very, you know, targeted in terms of topic, then you might be well-hosted and, and, and, you know, you, you, you...

276
00:46:11.240 --> 00:46:19.280
It might be a good decision to, to go to a half-day, you know, conference with, with five speakers, you know, and get a deep, deep insight on, on a dedicated topic.

277
00:46:19.740 --> 00:46:31.400
But if you want to get a complete overview of all kind of things which are, which belongs to our industry, then the bigger events are more appropriate for you. So- Okay... are there too, too many events?

278
00:46:31.440 --> 00:46:34.230
There are too many similar events. Let, let's say it like this.

279
00:46:34.320 --> 00:46:46.520
There are too many copycats from my perspective who wanted to take part in this business model, which is an attractive one, you're right, but I don't think that is a long-lasting model. Okay. Christian, thank you.

280
00:46:46.560 --> 00:47:03.900
In part two, we're gonna talk about which the copycats are, but you're gonna have to stay tuned for that. Thanks so much. See you, see you in Miami Beach. Thank you so much. [outro music]